Xtreme Pro: CMYK transparency fade trouble in PDF

[Nostaw]

OK, below you'll see an Image, on the right hand side you see Xara Xtreme Pro, a blue background using CMYK color. Ontop of it is a bitmap with a simple transparency fade. This has been exported to PDF (default setting 'Commercial printing' - if you look to the right hand side, this is the exported PDF...


I also exported the entire background as TIFF CMYK , imported it back again in Xara and replaced the background with the TIFF image. When I export the document now to PDF, the background color does not match the original blue color - it is darker.

Any clues?
My experience so far, stay away from transparency fades when working with CMYK? Is this how everyone else handles it?

Thanks for your suggestions.

[steve.ledger]

OK, below you'll see an Image, on the right hand side you see Xara Xtreme Pro, ...........

??

I think I worked it out you mean't the other right

Anyhow - yes I'm led to believe this is an issue with Acrobats rendering the on screen colours.
How do they compare when printed though?
(Acrobat draws text that has been converted to shapes horribly too - but they print fine)

[gnurf]

I have had similar problems, usually with drop shadows over a bitmap background. The drop shadows are rendered as bitmaps and the "bounding box" of the drop shadow is often slightly visible both in Acrobat reader and on paper when printed. I haven't figured out if it is due to color profiles of the bitmaps used or what. I usually export as PDF/X and have Xtreme Pro and Acrobat CS3 Pro.

The problem is that sometimes it works OK while other times the transparent areas aren't 100% transparent, and I haven't been able to recreate the error from scratch.

[Nostaw]

??

I think I worked it out you mean't the other right

Yes sorry, I made a mistake but you got it right.

Well I've found another problem, tinting bitmaps with a process color doesn't print it as a process color
See the image below..

Is there ANY way of getting a bitmap printed as a process color within Xara??

[Albacore]

Two things here, yes transparencies are hard for printers to handle and get right and yes Xara transparencies are different from what Adobe wants but when you are just using linear with one node they do print but need tweaked. Have a look at Gary's method that he used in a workbook last year cos it is the way that I do it to be sure that it is right. Take your transparency and make a bit map copy of it, then get rid of the trans so that the bitmap replaces the trans. Basically this is the way that the PDF treats the area but your are taking the risk out of it.

The other way is to forget about the bitmap copy and when you go on to export rather than using the commercial settings use PDF/X-1a under Custom settings as this treats transparencies correctly. This last method requires you to talk to your printer and trust him to tweak you trans just before it is printed. If you go into print shops even after 5 years of being able to produce & print transparencies there few being done because of the problems they cause.

Since ver, 7 and above Acro has always displayed text very poorly on the screen and even drawings look bad when zoom levels are above 100% but they print well. The colour shift has always been a problem in Xara as it still remains an RGB based vector programme with CMYK capabilities, turn on Simulate Printer Colours and that will give you a rough idea what it will look like but reds going into blues can be difficult.

Main thing here is to go and see your printer talk to him and get his advice but don't talk about Xara.

[Nostaw]

Two things here, yes transparencies are hard for printers to handle and get right and yes Xara transparencies..

I can truely live with the idea of making a bitmap copy of the whole background - in fact I did, but I need the entire background as a spot color and not a CMYK color. How can I achieve having a bitmap (greyscales) as a spot color printed out of Xara as PDF?

Have a look at Gary's method that he used in a workbook last year cos it is the way that I do it to be sure that it is right.

Thanks for your advise. Can you please give me a link of what that workbook, I can't seem to find it.

Take your transparency and make a bit map copy of it, then get rid of the trans so that the bitmap replaces the trans.

Yes I did all that too - the problem is then I can't have the background as a process color in xara. PLUS all the CMYK levels are wrong again when exported the CMYK bitmap out of Xara as PDF.

The other way is to forget about the bitmap copy and when you go on to export rather than using the commercial settings use PDF/X-1a under Custom settings as this treats transparencies correctly.

Oh allright, I just exported as "Adobe Reader 7 PDF 1.6" CMYK and it seems to handle transparencies. Thanks!

Main thing here is to go and see your printer talk to him and get his advice but don't talk about Xara.

Oh yes, I know all that. Once you mention a program they don't know, they have found the scapegoat.

[Albacore]

Sorry I did not have time this morning to post the link had to go to work. Here is Garys workbook and you will probablly have it in your CD so just look for "Workbook 47" and take it from there. Here is the link for people who don't have the CD: http://www.xaraxone.com/webxealot/workbook47/page_5.htm

[behzad]

When your printers rip the pdf they should send you back a soft copy for your approval, it is there that you can see if your transparencies are okay or not.

Always talk to your printers, my printers wanted the latest pdf/x version.