HTML Graphics

[Egg Bramhill]

Agreed. But let's walk before we can run. We haven't got the option to export other than 32 bit PNG's or JPG at the moment.

If I understand you correctly, you're saying that if you import a 4bit GIF, XXP should export this as a 4bit PNG? If I create a rectangle with a graduated fill XXP should know that this needs to be exported as a JPG not a 4 bit PNG? I could'nt say whether that's possible.

[steve.ledger]

If I understand you correctly, you're saying that if you import a 4bit GIF, XXP should export this as a 4bit PNG?

yes

Xtreme should be aware of the imported GIF properties and maintain them. You cannot add any quality to a 4bit or 8bit colour image by saving it to a 32bit True colour one, so you are adding to the file size for no good reason.

If I create a rectangle with a graduated fill XXP should know that this needs to be exported as a JPG not a 4 bit PNG? I could'nt say whether that's possible.

no

Xtreme expects that you would want to maintain that same high quality result which was created 'within' Xtreme using Xtremes tools. So no, Xtreme should not choose JPG for a graduated fill rectangle (which, by the way it doesn't), but rightly use 32bit PNG. But of course you can force it with the named JPEG option.

However, if you really wanted it exported a graduated fill rectangle to 8 or 4bit, then the case for added options to the name tool is applicable.

Good thread by the way.

[handrawn]

just to say I agree - if we are not to have gif's then we need control over png in the same way we have it in the export dialog - however that might be achieved

[covoxer]

Hi everyone,

Ok, we'll consider a better control of the exported mode and quality of images.

eg: in my test, an 89KB 8bit GIF file becomes a 168KB 32bit PNG

This is not a critical size increase. It's not even near to the difference between png and jpeg on photo images. Besides, I can demonstrate a reverse case, when 4bpp GIF is much larger than 32bpp PNG (see attachment).

You cannot add any quality to a 4bit or 8bit colour image by saving it to a 32bit

Not quite true. If you have antialiased edge (which happens to any kind of object if it's not perfectly rectangular and pixel aligned), it requires transparency, which has much better quality with 32bit PNG alpha channel than with a quirky transparent color in the paletted modes.

[handrawn]

thanks - appreciate that

I don't put photos on the web - in fact I don't use photos much at all.....

[covoxer]

I don't put photos on the web - in fact I don't use photos much at all.....

Yes, but I'm pretty sure you use a lot of subtle gradients. If it's true, you should probably prefer 32bit PNG over 8bit since it reproduces gradients much better.

BTW The best use of paletted modes (8bit and aspecially 4bit per pixel) is with lineart drwings which use flat fills and a limited number of colors/tints. This excludes complex synthesized fills (like gradients and aspecially fractal fills), any kind of semitransparency and all the photograhpic or photorealistic stuff. If you have shadows, feather, gradients, blends or more than a dozen of actually used colors, you probably should not sacrifice quality to the possible win in size, especially knowing that such a win is relatively small in this kind of graphics.

[handrawn]

Yes John exactly - you hit the nail on the head

When I do full color work: 32bit png

But when I do line art or limited color - which as a cartoonist I do a lot - then there is no point going above 8bit

I need it both ways

Thanks again for taking this on board