Thank you and good bye! I'm no longer Xara's target audience.

[haakoo]

Yes Steve.

But I'm getting sick and tired about the whining about tools that are on someones long year list and then saying the business direction is flawed
and even argument-ed with false facts as everyone can see the amount of new members in the forum which will only be a part of the actual new users.
To this i say thumbs up.
I do think that some members are searching in the minor details for little things that they can complain about.(get a life)
The used behavior I notice everyday with my 6 year old son and 4 year old daughter.

Now when a new member or old member (re)enters the forum it only sees the complaints made by the loudest shouting persons.
I think these people should be put in place as it is not in the interest of this forum as for the future of xara products.

[handrawn]

such is democracy

but I hear what you say Hans

[covoxer]

Thank you Hans, you just have perfectly explained my feelings about this situation too.

[remi]

Yes, I agree with you Steve (handrawn). It's sad to see the usual "fight" between fanboys and critics - also since years without a change ("Hans" was added to my "fanboy" drawer, just now).

btw: I'm so glad that I don't smoke - neither tobacco nor drugs.

One of the next postings (or even a new thread) is about the great members/moderators/developers who are spending their time unselfish every day, hours and hours again in order to help out customers to overcome the missing functions through workarounds and really don't like to see such "negative" postings about their beloved Xara Xtreme...

But this will not change the "feeling", that eobet is right with his thread title, when he is saying that _he_ is no longer Xara's target audience.

We need a change

Remi

[haakoo]

Steve J.

Democracy is about compromising in a way that everybody sees the bigger picture and agree to take a road together.
In a real democracy they are allowed to complain about it in an ordinary fashion.
The way it is going now,is not like a civilized democracy anymore

[remi]

Sorry, Hans but the OP, some other members and I are trying to argue against a wrong product policy and you are (trying) to get personal against me? Who, do you think, is childish? And which behaviour is not "civilized" anymore?

Please think about, what you have written.

Remi

[covoxer]

...the OP, some other members and I are trying to argue against a wrong product policy...

1. I don't see OP actually argue anything, he just informed us about his decision. We do understand his choice and wish him good luck. Subject closed, no arguments were intended. There is a separate thread specially created by JA to discuss our product policy.
2. Our product policy is not wrong. It is exactly what xara founders, owners and investors want it to be. It would be wrong, if they were unhappy with it.

[MerryOtter]

And which behaviour is not "civilized" anymore?

Well, I think it's one thing to move on to a different program if it's not meeting your needs anymore, it's quite another to deliberately rain on the parade of an objectively great release to a community of users with a rant about how much you hate the direction the software is taking and why you're leaving forever. That is why I felt compelled to provide a counterbalance and explain some of the reasons why I'm excited about Xara Xtreme 5.

it's not the question if someone is looking down on your design work or not.

Hm. It struck me that, "it's obvious that you don't work with CMYK very much," and "Hmm, promotional emails" was just a little bit condescending But that just reflects the core problem. Everyone thinks their universe is the only universe, that it should be obvious to everyone that something doesn't have any worth if it doesn't meet their particular needs.

I think the Xara gallery proves without doubt that "fine art" is absolutely possible with Xara Xtreme. And sometimes, promo mails can be artful, too. Or at least clever.

In a way, the subject of this thread is accurate, honest and neutral. Here's a guy who doesn't think that Xara is addressing his needs any more, so he's moving on. But there is an undercurrent of bitterness which I don't think is really necessary or effective. I'm sure the folks at Xara would love to get to many of the items on their (and our) wish list, like CMYK. But like everyone who lives in the real world, they have to pay the bills.

If they can sell enough copies to "regular Joes" who foolishly want red-eye removal, to support the development of CMYK and other demands of the elite class, then more power to them. Furthermore, as covoxer pointed out...

Our product policy is not wrong. It is exactly what xara founders, owners and investors want it to be. It would be wrong, if they were unhappy with it.

...people write software, start companies, etc., because of a vision they have. That is what gives them the energy to get up each morning and put in 12-hour days. Obviously their vision is not to be an Illustrator clone.

Honestly, apart from the fact that the specific features in V5 are very relevant to what I do day-to-day, I am grateful for the fact that they are taking this direction. It's a unique way of doing online content that is more visual and compelling than what traditional Web editors like Dreamweaver offer. (And just ask newspapers, book publishers and magazines how well print media is doing.) It's a great fusion of Web editor, bitmap editor, and vector tool. It's got some fun stuff like the 3D effects that I use more than I thought I would, and it continues to differentiate itself from the pack with its speed, usability, flexibility, and overall value. They are playing to their strengths.

If that means that a few high-brow designer types think they've graduated to the world of Adobe, that's fine by me. They have plenty of company.

[remi]

Well, I think it's one thing to move on to a different program if it's not meeting your needs anymore, it's quite another to deliberately rain on the parade of an objectively great release to a community of users with a rant about how much you hate the direction the software is taking and why you're leaving forever. That is why I felt compelled to provide a counterbalance and explain some of the reasons why I'm excited about Xara Xtreme 5.

The only problem with this, is that I don't feel like a member of Xara Ltd.'s marketing team. If some of the fanboys out there are thinking that they have to participate on a "parade", in order to increase Xara's success to such a product policy, so let them do so. But I don't think that Xara Xtreme 5 is a "great" release, the same as with the former version 4 of Xara Xtreme. And as I've learned I'm not alone with my dissappointment about the output of the Xara developer group. And unfortunately this is part of a bigger picture - I call it a trend - with wrong decisions made by Xara Ltd.

This is not directed to you, but to some other intolerant fanboys: I don't accept the attempts from some fanboys, whenever they are trying to talk "bad" about such disappointed, often long-time customers of Xara, just because they are seeing things different after a long time of wasted hope. Yes, some of us are posting their critiques loud and clearly, but there is nothing wrong with that. The more customers are muttering their discontent, the quicker Xara Ltd. will wake up.

Remi

[ss-kalm]

The only problem with this, is that I don't feel like a member of Xara Ltd.'s marketing team.

Apologies if this is a language problem, but you are not part of Xara's marketing team, unless you are employed by Xara.

And as I've learned I'm not alone with my dissappointment about the output of the Xara developer group. And unfortunately this is part of a bigger picture - I call it a trend - with wrong decisions made by Xara Ltd...

You have no idea if this is a wrong decision by Xara. It's only a wrong decision as far as you are concerned.

It seems to me that Xara have gained many more users by the introduction of the Web portion of the programme, than they have lost by not updating the vector tools. Therefore their marketing team is obviously doing things right from their point of view.