Is anyone else upset that updates are $19.95?

[bb2]

Ive posted an explanation at http://talkgraphics.com/groupee/foru...86&m=548108006 for FP-User.

In my opinion this is not a bug within webstyle/menu maker

Ta

[FoxyBia]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> You are like the proverbial company that sells new cars for $500.00 each. There is a catch, the cars have been modified to only run on a special fuel which is only available from them and they are charging $100 a gallon for it now <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I see it the exact same way. Good analogy!

For FP User: Thank you for understanding my point and taking my concerns seriously. From your post, I am assuming you work for Xara and I would just like to say that I think they should hire more people like you. Customers don't like to feel like they don't matter. When we have a concern or an issue we like to be heard and understood. Threatening and ignoring a client is not the way to do business and that has been the response I've been getting from everyone else here. I appreciate you taking the time to truely listen to what we're saying!!

As for example s of other software companies, I have a few. All of them!! Web design software companies like MS Frontpage, Macromedia Dreamweaver, IBM home page builder all provide free updates and patches for as long as you use the software. Whenever their is an update available the customer is invited to use it for free, they even have special places on their website reserved for downloading updates and that's if it's not done automatically. Most of the companies (big or small) work that way. I have been a long time customer of Macromedia and Microsoft and throughout the years that I've used their softwares I never once had to pay to get an update on my version... ever!! Not one single brown penny. As for other companies, I would have to look but I am almost certain they work the same way.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Yes, I would be very interested to know of any similar editable-template based products and investigate them further - whether they continue to offer new templates for free or not! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Kate, Considering you work for Xara, I would assume that would be part of your job. You should already be well aware of what your competitors are offering, it's business 101. It is not our job to research this and supply you with the information, it should already be done!! I'm sorry if I am being rude but I think you have a really bad attitiude towards the customers and our complaints. What exactly is your job? are you a moderator or do you work in the customer service department?? I find it hard to believe that they would hire someone with your attitude to represent them to their customers.

~The customer is always right!~ Remember that when dealing with customers. It's the building block of any and all successful companies!!
DF

[toprobroy]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> So if we are to do more design work, we can put the initial price up, we can put the upgrade price up, or we can charge for extra releases. Pros and cons, but to my mind the latter seems best <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

AND

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> As an aside, we have been asked for more themed ones in future packs (sporting themes, weddings that sort of thing) and that does seem like a good suggestion and we'll likely try that going forward. Suggestions welcome. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You might like to look at the Designs that are Very Cheaply Available from wwwDesignload

The design work is all done, so you needn't charge all the monies you've justified. If these can be made available to Webstyle, then we're really cookin. There's 100's on here and at $49.95 per year, its excellent value. This could be a model you could use. i.e. Charge an annual fee for access, with guarantees that there will be new ones available. I do know of other sites as well that give you excellent designs, which with careful negotiation will produce a Win Win situation for all concerned.

Comments Please
Robert

[FoxyBia]

That is a Fantastic Suggestion!!!

DF

[pcontour]

DollFace: http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif Thank You very much for the compliment. I don't work for Xara, although I did send them a note offering to work for them from here in Canada, monitoring the board on a regular basis, and providing input to the next releases by getting a customer consensus here. I view support in a radical way as a marketing function. Support can become a strategic and essential partner at the design and business development table, but many companies want to pay peanuts for support, treat the people like dirt, and not listen to them. It's easier to keep a customer and get them to recommend you to a friend than it is to find a new one. Marketing people get paid in big fat coconuts, instead of peanuts. Coconut Grove: that's for me. http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

And Dollface Your candor is essential. A complaining customer is a good thing; better than one who's given up and gone away.

toprobroy: I will certainly check out the other site you mentioned for themes, I appreciate the headsup.

Finally, it's a good value for the money.

[AntonyF]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>was within 4 weeks of the release. I am assuming new purchasers get ALL available templates PLUS they are getting another free add on package "fonts+" I think. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

They won't get all templates, no. The add-on pack will still need to be purchased. But you are correct that there is currently a special offer on for a Fonts CD....

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Please consider adding a 90 day or six month new owner grace period.

Have you ever heard of Sears? They are a rather major department store in the US. If I go there and purchase an item and find that same item on sale there within a period of time, I go into the store and they gladly refund the difference. Most major sofware vendors provide free updates for a year on their products. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think you need to have distinction between the two issues. Firstly, that sales or offers can go on after you've purchased the software. This can be frustratingly admittedly, but this is pretty much standard with every shop on the planet. Sears may be different, but Xara isn't Sears. Most of the time if prices go down, or special offers happen, then it's just the way it is. I've spent £360 ($650 on some DVDs). I could have bought them from the US for around £40 ($72). They're even half the original price here in the UK now. But there's no way I could go back to Amazon and demand refunds or whatever... it wouldn't happen. I just had to settle with the fact that I bought those products at that time.

In terms of software updates, yes many companies do offer free updates for a certain period. As do Xara. But you need to distinguish between software updates, and additional add-ons. When you buy Webstyle on the web it says how many templates you get, and you get them all. In no way do you not get what is sold on the Xara website.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>You are like the proverbial company that sells new cars for $500.00 each. There is a catch, the cars have been modified to only run on a special fuel which is only available from them and they are charging $100 a gallon for it now. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually, a car analogy is a very good one. To use your example, Xara sells a car that has all the features listed for the price listed. There's no hidden secrets. You'll also get a warranty, which covers the car itself (which is like software updates and support). However, if you then want to add a DVD player for example, you'll need to pay extra. It's not listed as part of the original car, it doesn't affect the usage of the car if you don't buy it -- but if you do want that DVD player, the option is there for you if you wish.

[JoeWebb]

Way to go Antony..I think you missed ALL the points...lol

Don't worry about it..they are spending time creating additional templates they can charge for instead of updating the program with bug fixes..etc..

My kind of Company...<grin>

Are you an employee?
You sound like it!

[AntonyF]

JoeWebb, obviously I've not been reading the same messages as you if I supposedly missed points. To further clarify some information...

There have been many bug fix releases for Webstyle which have been released. And, for that matter, there was some extra templates released for free (which I don't think has been mentioned once in this thread, incidentally).

The thing is, most of these changes are seamless... so you may not be even aware of a lot of this, and that's a good thing. Smooth operation is important.

If we bug fix Webstyle, we immediately put the new file up for download. That way if you install from the web, you have the latest version. If you installed the latest version of Windows, you'd probably spend all day patching it.

We could release ten patches for everyone to apply, but why would that be good for a customer?

Most changes to Xara products, bugs in particular, are driven from customer feedback. If serious bugs turn up then I'm sure Webstyle will get another update. But these updates are done as required. Various factors have to be taken into account when decisions are made... i.e. what the problems is, what caused it, how it can be fixed effectively, and most importantly how to ensure that they change affect users adversley. Quite often people report a "bug" which is often just a problem with their system or just something they can't use.

So to claim that nothing the programme has not been updated with bug fixes is just plain wrong.

And yes, I am an employee for your information. But I've not been told to write any of this, just as a TalkGraphics users I feel I need to give my view on this.

[pcontour]

Anthony. I think JoeWebb meant the opposite of what he said that's why he finished with the "LOL". He was acknowledging that you actually covered all the points.

[FoxyBia]

Concerning what AnthonyF wrote, personally I think you did miss the point.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> So to claim that nothing the programme has not been updated with bug fixes is just plain wrong.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nobody said anything about bug fixes in the first place so I don't know how you got on that topic, which is why I say you missed the point!! We are not saying that Xara doesn't offer bug fixes, we are talking about being charged for the newly available templates and fonts.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>In terms of software updates, yes many companies do offer free updates for a certain period. As do Xara. But you need to distinguish between software updates, and additional add-ons. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If Xara Webstyle was offering a shopping cart integration feature, for example, then yes that would definitly be an "add-on". But considering that Xara WS is essentially a graphics/template authoring tool for web sites, I don't see how newly available templates would be considered an add-on.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Actually, a car analogy is a very good one. To use your example, Xara sells a car that has all the features listed for the price listed. There's no hidden secrets. You'll also get a warranty, which covers the car itself (which is like software updates and support). However, if you then want to add a DVD player for example, you'll need to pay extra. It's not listed as part of the original car, it doesn't affect the usage of the car if you don't buy it -- but if you do want that DVD player, the option is there for you if you wish.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Your analogy doesn't fit this situation. A DVD is an extra, a luxury option. Templates are not especially since Webstyle basically consists of only templates. A DVD in a car is more like a shopping cart integration in websytle. It's an extra that's available if you have the money!!

My car analogy is this, Xara sells a car with all the basic features (engine, seats, steering wheel, windows etc...) but only includes one tire rim and half a paint job. If we want the rest of the car painted and the rims, we have to pay extra for them. We don't actually need a paint job or the rims because our car runs fine without them BUT the car would look alot better and we would be much happier if it was included. And while alll other car dealerships are selling the car with the paint job and the rims, our dealer is not!! That's how I see it!!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I think you need to have distinction between the two issues. Firstly, that sales or offers can go on after you've purchased the software. This can be frustratingly admittedly, but this is pretty much standard with every shop on the planet. Sears may be different, but Xara isn't Sears. Most of the time if prices go down, or special offers happen, then it's just the way it is. I've spent £360 ($650 on some DVDs). I could have bought them from the US for around £40 ($72). They're even half the original price here in the UK now. But there's no way I could go back to Amazon and demand refunds or whatever... it wouldn't happen. I just had to settle with the fact that I bought those products at that time.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Again, you are missing the point! Your example and what we're talking about have nothing to do with each other. It's not like Xara is having a special sale on their software and we now want the difference refunded. We just didn't expect to install the software and see a whole bunch of dollar signs next to many of the templates. That's the issue here.


Concerning everything you said about bug fixes, it's seems that you are trying to say that we should be thankful for not being charged for bug fixes. If you're software has "bugs" in it and doesn't work properly, obviously you need to correct the problem. That goes without saying. If you tried to charge people for bug fixes you would get sued up the a** for selling software that doesn't work properly. Every company provides bug fixes and patches on their software, it's their responsibility to make sure their software works the way it's supposed to.

Aagin, our issue is with the templates. Most of us were just very surprised to see dollar signs next to the new templates after having just bought the latest version. We assumed that all available templates would be included in the version we just purchased. That's usually how most things work.

DF