Is anyone else upset that updates are $19.95?

[FoxyBia]

Thanks for the tip but I already updated webstyle and received all the templates available. What I'm talking about is the others that say "new" and require you to puchase them. I don't remember reading anywhere that after purchasing the software I would still have to pay extra to get all the templates. It was very disappointing to me because I was not expecting it to be this way. From my experience, when you buy a software you get everything that comes with it and most of the time you even get free updates (not upgrades).

As for the Xara link in the menu, I made that navigation/menu right after I paid for the full version using the download they provide us with (while we are waiting for the C.D. to arrive.) I am assuming that was not the trial version but I'm not sure!! I will try to make another one using the actual webstyle C.D. If you are right I will be much more happy then I was yesterday!!

DF

[katemoir]

Perhaps the problem is that people are confused about what constitutes a 'template'. Each individual graphic in Webstyle is a template - every banner ad, every 3D heading, every NavBar etc. When you purchase Webstyle 4 you get about 1600 templates. I'm wondering whether some people only consider page designs to be 'templates' and forget about all the other types of graphic in all the other categories?

If that's not the issue, and you still think you're missing templates then try a) hitting the Update Webstyle button to download the complete set or b) installing from the CD which has the complete set.

Template Pack 1 for Webstyle 4 is an optional extra template pack that was launched after Webstyle 4. It offers 23 new banner ad templates, and 5 complete page designs. A small number relative to the total.

There is a reason why we offer this as an optional extra. It was a very frequent user request from Webstyle 1 and 2 owners that we refreshed the template sets between our product updates (which normally fall every 12-14 months for Webstyle). This seemed like a reasonable request and a good idea and we released our first template pack in the last few months of Webstyle 3. However, if we are to put extra manpower into template design then that has to be paid for - designers are no different to programmers, sad but true they have to be paid! So if we are to do more design work, we can put the initial price up, we can put the upgrade price up, or we can charge for extra releases. Pros and cons, but to my mind the latter seems best - you look at the new designs, buy them if you like them and think they're worth it. We could always revert to the old policy, not do the extra templates between product updates, but on the whole I have to tell you that the vast majority of feedback on the new template packs has been positive. I know they'd be even more popular if they were free, but hey, even designers have to live on something!

[FoxyBia]

I agree with you completely, I was not trying to say that the web designers should not get paid for their work. I am a web design student and obviously would want to get paid for the work I do.

I also think it's a good idea to allow people to puchase additional "templates" especially for those who have been users for a while and would like to have some fresh themes. I on the other hand have just bought the software a couple of days ago and was surprised to see all these "new" templates that weren't included. Perhaps you can't understand that considering your position. I guess I just was not expecting it to be this way. Had you guys mentioned something about the way it works I would have been a lot less surprised and ultimately not as angry as I was.

I am also not trying to ruin it for the people who are happy with the way Xara works.

"We could always revert to the old policy"
There's no need for that, I was merely expressing the way I felt, I was not speaking for the entire community!!

DF

[JoeWebb]

Mine was a recent purchase too..4 weeks...

I do suggest you change your policy...MOST good sofware vendors provide updates for a year after the purchase anyway...

If nothing else, find a way that we can hide the Non-Purchased templates...forget the $$ sign, just omit them form the listings.

[pcontour]

We could always revert to the old policy, I think this veiled threat is bad business, especially when your frequently asked question page said the following just 2 days ago.

Here is what is in your, FAQ email, which I received May 3, 2004.

Can I download Webstyle and the templates as soon as I purchase?

Yes. Whether you order the CD or retail box version, you will be able to immediately unlock the Webstyle trial and download all of the templates.

I noticed Xara has since removed this FAQ, when I checked back today. This and Kates visit may be a result of my sending a note to Xara support to try to find out what the real story is on these template. It is this FAQ that people had read that made them so angry.

Kate I think it is very important that Xara be upfront with the customers. I appreciate your setting the record straight on the contents of the template pack. It's prudent that the erroneous FAQ has been removed. The point people are trying to make is that other companies somehow manage to pay their designers and include all their templates with the original product. On my part I don't have an example of this that I can point to. I have found the product to be a great timesaver and a great value, and I haven't even gotten into the templates.

Kate my suggestion for good business, would be like this. I understand that many people think that we should include the template pack for free. Our management had considered that option. Perhaps it would be a good idea for us to revisit that, since people in this forum have mentioned that other companies are doing things better than XARA is, regarding templates. I personally haven't experienced this. If you can help me get started by provide me specific details including those companies websites, I will investigate this issue further and present my finding to management again.

DollFace: Your concerns are real and I get the impression that most users feel the same way, whether correctly or misguided. I think is is eqaully important for Xara as a business entity to manage customer expectations, as it is for them to provide the best product. One mismanaged client can lead to 10 missed sales.


New Users: In my opinion everything you see in the demo with $$ attached to it is included with the product when you pay. Nothing from the additional template pack appears in the demo in any way. Can someone who knows if I'm correct for sure about the items with $$ on them please respond.

[katemoir]

"The point people are trying to make is that other companies somehow manage to pay their designers and include all their templates with the original product."

Yes, I would be very interested to know of any similar editable-template based products and investigate them further - whether they continue to offer new templates for free or not! But I cannot/will not pretend that we are reconsidering the chargeable template packs when we're not, that would simply not be true. If customers had voted against the template pack by not buying it, or if negative feedback had exceeded positive, we would not have done another one. But Pack 1 has been very popular, take-up has exceeded our expectations, the feedback has been largely positive and I feel sure we will do more. As an aside, we have been asked for more themed ones in future packs (sporting themes, weddings that sort of thing) and that does seem like a good suggestion and we'll likely try that going forward. Suggestions welcome.

" New Users: In my opinion everything you see in the demo with $$ attached to it is included with the product when you pay. Nothing from the additional template pack appears in the demo in any way. Can someone who knows if I'm correct for sure about the items with $$ on them please respond."

Now this is something we are indeed reconsidering. The answer is actually yes and no. The standard trial shows only the templates that you get when you purchase Webstyle 4, all with a $ beside them. Most users will never see any others and that's why some people are genuinely puzzled about this issue. However, if you hit the Update Webstyle button while you still have the trial, it will detect that there are some templates available that are not showing in your version, and it will download the previews with a NEW$ next to them.

This was not completely intentional - the purpose of the Update button was to devise a really slick method of informing existing owners when optional new templates were made available, to let them download previews straight into the program so they could decide whether they wanted them or not. What we might do if we feel the balance of opinion is for it, is prevent trial users from using the Update Webstyle feature. It seems a shame not to let trial users see the full potential range of designs, but I can also see that it might be confusing.

[pcontour]

http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/smile.gif Thanks for clearing up those misconceptions for me Kate. So many people have been thinking that when they bought the product they weren't getting everything they had seen, it was confusing me, as I'm just finishing my trial period.

I'm not asking you to pretend, but if you did find actual situations that indicate that it would make sense for business practices to change, you would surely tell your manager.

If you have time Kate, there is a dotted line issue that's concerning me with regards to my potential purchase.

http://talkgraphics.com/groupee/foru...86&m=548108006

[katemoir]

Strangely enough, I can't see the dotted lines on either site, in any state. Can you tell me which browser incl. version you are using.

[pcontour]

http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/smile.gif Hi and thanks, I'm gonig to answer in the other topic where the guy who found it is looking at it now as well. OK

[JoeWebb]

Regarding the $$ templates..

I am a paid user with registered software. Until you released the new templates, 4 weeks after I purchased your software, I had no $$ marked templates.

Now there are numerous $$ marked templates.

I want the ability to hide those $$ templates.

Let's look at the future..let's say for example that I continue to use your product but NEVER purchase your new templates. Four years go by and you have released 10 new sets of templates. Can you imagine what the template lists would look like?

I would want to see what is available in each potentially purchased set at any time but I don't want to have to pick thru them each time I use the system!

Now to try and explain why I am upset about the update fees...:

1) My purchase was within 4 weeks of the release. I am assuming new purchasers get ALL available templates PLUS they are getting another free add on package "fonts+" I think.

Please consider adding a 90 day or six month new owner grace period.

Have you ever heard of Sears? They are a rather major department store in the US. If I go there and purchase an item and find that same item on sale there within a period of time, I go into the store and they gladly refund the difference. Most major sofware vendors provide free updates for a year on their products.

2) I did actually consider purchasing the new templates but then realized that it was way overpriced. What percentage of the original purchase price is $19.95? Too High!

You are like the proverbial company that sells new cars for $500.00 each. There is a catch, the cars have been modified to only run on a special fuel which is only available from them and they are charging $100 a gallon for it now.

A real example was a printer company that sells good printer dirt cheap with special ink cartridges that are really expensive and unique.

If your company focuses on after market sales rather than improving the primary products you will end up with whole bunch of add ons with no one to sell them too.

If you should care to communicate with me directly please respond to

webmaster@host-biz.com
Joe Brouillard