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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    Quote Originally Posted by shiphen View Post
    1. When you put an arrowhead on a line it finishes BEYOND the end of the line. [WTF?!]
    Xara might mntion Smart Lines. I wouldn't but it is part of the engine so won't change.
    Quote Originally Posted by shiphen View Post
    5. XDP has a bug that when you change the centre of rotation of a shape it does idiotic things and the next shape rotates in some bizarre way (I forget the details).
    It is not a bug. In use, it does make sense.
    Quote Originally Posted by shiphen View Post
    There isn't a quick and easy way to rotate an object by 90 degrees
    There is and it is intuitive. Ctrl+Rotate will lock to 90 degrees in steps of 45 degrees.
    Quote Originally Posted by shiphen View Post
    To me, the slow death of Xara is nothing short of a tragedy.
    It sounds to me like Xara need a whole change of management ethos. Someone there needs to read "The Lean Startup" (by Eric Ries) and apply its principles of getting close to real new users.
    Can't they just sell the whole thing to someone who at least gets the basics right?
    Totally agree.

    Acorn
    Acorn - My currently active Xara software: XDPX (current, v15, v12 & 11 (64-bit)), unserviced XWD Premium 15 & 12, XPGD10, X3D7; lots of licences back through time (to CC's Artworks). If your Post identifies a Xara software fault, please raise it directly with Magix --> support2.magix.com.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    Quote Originally Posted by shiphen View Post
    But my general point is that XDP needs an interface that is much more obvious to new users. I showed XDP to a highly 'computer literate' friend the other day. He's talented guy. He's done a fair bit of graphics in all manner of different applications. But he was quickly cursing and swearing at XDP.
    therein lies my point

    xara are designing just such an interface - in the cloud, they don't have a lot of time/resource for other things

    and your friend might well have found it 'trying', that's a learning curve, and it's not perfect but neither is anything else

    and Xara need to adapt
    the are !... in the cloud, like it or not

    And are most users really expecting it to default to ANTI-clockwise? Maybe... but I somehow doubt it!
    maybe this is an old CAD/CAM convention, i don't know... but in trigonometry if I remember correctly, by convention, anti[counter]clockwise is positive, and clockwise is negative, so if the person who designed it was a mathematician [or CAD/CAM possibly] that may explain it [I think it's to do with direction of travel towards positive and negative axis values and somewhat arcane to the mathematically challenged, I am sure Acorn will know]

    To me, the slow death of Xara is nothing short of a tragedy

    It sounds to me like Xara need a whole change of management ethos. Someone there needs to read "The Lean Startup" (by Eric Ries) and apply its principles of getting close to real new users.

    Can't they just sell the whole thing to someone who at least gets the basics right?
    Xara is not dying [I hope] maybe it's desktop is stagnating but that is because as I understand it, the commercial base that can return a margin on investment is wafer thin; it is too late - we all, them and us, have to move on
    -------------------------------
    carpe diem
    carpo vitae

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    > It is not a bug. In use, it does make sense.
    Personally I found it extremely counter-intuitive.

    Here's what my XDP10 does:
    1. I change the centre of rotation of Shape A, and rotate it.

    2. Now I select Shape B, and it wants to rotate around that same point.
    Personally 9 times out of 10 I don't want that.

    3. But what I definitely do want is for Shape A to remember where I had moved its centre of rotation to, however Shape A has forgotten.

    So is that genuinely how XDP is supposed to behave? I mean why when I change something does it apply the change to the next thing I touch but then immediately forget the change to the shape in question?

    Sounds deeply counter-intuitive to me... but I digress.


    > the commercial base that can return a margin on investment is wafer thin;
    Yes there is always a learning curve for anything new, however some user interfaces are broadly intuitive and some are not. In its day 25 years ago Xara was way more intuitive than its competitors. But during the last 25 years, UIs have moved on. And users have new learnt conventions. But Xara has adopted almost none of them.

    Either way, like I say I have been a fan all this time, but despite demonstrating Xara to maybe 10 or 15 people over the last 15 years, I don't think a single person ever liked Xara enough to buy a copy. And that HAS to say something!

    > xara are designing just such an interface - in the cloud,
    Can you say more - will it be a full-on replacement for XDP?

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    I really dont agree with the statement that basically says "the interface was intuitive 25 years ago and it hasn't changed so now it's not intuitive."

    I still think that Xara's learnin curve is quite small. Everything is where I expect it to be.
    Keith
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    There are 10 types of people in this world .... Those who understand binary, and those who don't.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    Quote Originally Posted by shiphen View Post
    And that HAS to say something!
    this was always the case - some loved it, some hated it - and there was never the corporate base to establish it mainstream

    in this respect I think, the company are maybe marketing the cloud app in the right way - maybe you should get out to one of the business conventions and bend the ear of a Xara Rep, should you be able to find one...

    > xara are designing just such an interface - in the cloud,
    Can you say more - will it be a full-on replacement for XDP?

    I have no inside info but I doubt it, certainly not in the near future... but eventually it may be that the cloud app becomes downloadable, like Adobe, though not necessarily their subscription model, and the current desktop will fade gently away into the oubliette that is Magix' back catalogue - but that's just my feeling and current opinion
    -------------------------------
    carpe diem
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  6. #26
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    Quote Originally Posted by ss-kalm View Post
    I really dont agree with the statement that basically says "the interface was intuitive 25 years ago and it hasn't changed so now it's not intuitive."

    I still think that Xara's learnin curve is quite small. Everything is where I expect it to be.
    We're going to have to agree to disagree on this.

    All I'll ask is: Have you ever watched a computer-literate, Xara novice attempt to use Xara?

    And if you say something like "yes lots of times, and they all absolutely loved and bought copies of Xara" how then would YOU account for Xara's commercial failure?

    J

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    Wow. This thread is both enlightening and depressing. Though Iíve been using Xara for over five years, I still consider myself a novice. I donít do commercial graphics work, but my businessís website. The idea that after investing so much money and time, the software may disappear because itís not keeping up with the demands is frustrating.

    I agree that too much is being done for the Cloud and not enough for the software itself. Many of us have no interest or use for the Cloud.

    But it seems that perhaps the unfortunate trigger for the changes in the company vision of Xara began when it was taken over by Magix. From product development to customer support, things have declined.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    Quote Originally Posted by gcellison View Post
    Wow. This thread is both enlightening and depressing. Though I’ve been using Xara for over five years, I still consider myself a novice. I don’t do commercial graphics work, but my business’s website. The idea that after investing so much money and time, the software may disappear because it’s not keeping up with the demands is frustrating.

    I agree that too much is being done for the Cloud and not enough for the software itself. Many of us have no interest or use for the Cloud.

    But it seems that perhaps the unfortunate trigger for the changes in the company vision of Xara began when it was taken over by Magix. From product development to customer support, things have declined.
    Once again, false information.
    1. The naysayers have been saying for years that Xara is dying. It has not and likely will not.
    2. Magix did not take over Xara. Magix does the marketing and selling for Xara, not product development
    3. Customer support goes through the Magix support page, and then I would expect that Xara queries are automatically forwarded to the Xara support people.

    Oops, poor customer support? I raised a ticket yesterday, Sunday, I have a reply with a solution today, Monday.

    As for shiphen's comments, I have PaintShop Pro and I managed to figure out, after a couple of years, how to draw a line and write some text over a photo. It is not obvious as you have to create separate layers to do this. You can't just drag a photo onto the arranger and then draw or write text on it. With Xara, just drag in a photo, draw a line or write text - no layer problems, nothing mysterious. If a computer-literate new user can't figure that out, then I would say that that user is not computer-literate, as there is nothing simpler than this, or they are just looking for something more complicated.

    Commercial failure? By what standard? The company is still there and still producing and upgrading its software.

    As for the title of this thread, has anyone put the question directly to Xara? I don't have a 4k screen, but I do have a 2736x1824 screen on my Surface Pro 4, and Xara works just fine.
    John
    Xara DPX(16.2.0.56957)

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    Quote Originally Posted by browj2 View Post
    Once again, false information.
    ...
    ...has anyone put the question directly to Xara? I don't have a 4k screen...
    "false" is somewhat strong as no one is trying to promote alternative facts. There is a perception that with Magix on support, being German, having no UK Xara directors and Xara Cloud being GmbH, then with Magix responsible for packaging and putting lots of nag-ware options in the product, there is a belief that there is a strong Magix / Xara Cloud influence on the delivery of features and the rectification of bugs. Magix does not own Xara. [See P.P.P.S. below]
    4k presentation of the XARA UI has been asked of Xara over many years and the response is that it is on the list...

    Recently, I have Dear Xara'd asking where the TG interaction has gone. The response is deafening: https://www.talkgraphics.com/search....rchid=8170391; two months of nothing.

    Acorn

    P.S. 4k offering 3840 x 2160 pixels is 150% resolution of your Surface Pro 4. Xara icons are about 32px square and menu text is around 12pt. scale these down by 66.67% and see what you reading position becomes.
    3840px could present 120 button icons across the screen; my Align and Standard Bars have about 35 icons so visualise the xara application having its controls in the left-most one third of the full screen.

    P.P.S. I would implore TG Mods not to close this Thread but rather move it to the Dear Xara Forum and use whatever back channels to get Xara to re-engage.

    P.P.P.S.
    Charles Moir Blog - http://charlesmoir.com/about.htm -
    I sold Xara to a German public software company. Then started a new company 6 years ago doing cloud (web based) software.
    Xara Group History - https://www.xara.com/uk/history/ -
    In 2007 the company was purchased by the German multi-media company MAGIX. Xara continues as a separate company, but is now part of the MAGIX group and has seen rapid international expansion as a result. We have the same world class team of developers working on the design products that are our strength, but benefit from the considerable marketing and development resources of MAGIX.

    Xara titles are now available under the MAGIX brand in German, French, Spanish, Dutch, Italian and Russian.
    Last edited by Acorn; 27 January 2020 at 04:34 PM. Reason: Clarification around ownership
    Acorn - My currently active Xara software: XDPX (current, v15, v12 & 11 (64-bit)), unserviced XWD Premium 15 & 12, XPGD10, X3D7; lots of licences back through time (to CC's Artworks). If your Post identifies a Xara software fault, please raise it directly with Magix --> support2.magix.com.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Will lack of 4K be the DEATH of Xara?

    Quote Originally Posted by browj2 View Post
    Once again, false information.
    1. The naysayers have been saying for years that Xara is dying. It has not and likely will not.
    2. Magix did not take over Xara. Magix does the marketing and selling for Xara, not product development
    3. Customer support goes through the Magix support page, and then I would expect that Xara queries are automatically forwarded to the Xara support people.

    Oops, poor customer support? I raised a ticket yesterday, Sunday, I have a reply with a solution today, Monday.

    As for shiphen's comments, I have PaintShop Pro and I managed to figure out, after a couple of years, how to draw a line and write some text over a photo. It is not obvious as you have to create separate layers to do this. You can't just drag a photo onto the arranger and then draw or write text on it. With Xara, just drag in a photo, draw a line or write text - no layer problems, nothing mysterious. If a computer-literate new user can't figure that out, then I would say that that user is not computer-literate, as there is nothing simpler than this, or they are just looking for something more complicated.

    Commercial failure? By what standard? The company is still there and still producing and upgrading its software.

    As for the title of this thread, has anyone put the question directly to Xara? I don't have a 4k screen, but I do have a 2736x1824 screen on my Surface Pro 4, and Xara works just fine.
    I was responding to the thread up to that point and adding my observations. I didn’t mean to ruffle any feathers. I’ve done no investigation to know how well Xara is doing commercially, but I hope very well, as I (and many others) have invested much effort in learning it.

    I’m glad your experience with customer support is good. For me, it’s been a bit slow (over a week to not until I sent them a reminder), and the answers I receive aren’t helpful. I find that I get much better advice if I post my question here on talkgraphics. And yes, the answers I got in the past from customer support were more helpful.

 

 

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