Fly knot?

[JZiehlke]

It's wonderful what a cup of coffee will do for you in the morning to help with the inspiration.

Joan

[gwpriester]

I never was very good with knots. All that over and under and around stuff leaves me, how can I say, tied up in knots. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif[/img]

Of all these fines examples, I like the simplicity and pencil-drawing-like quality of Karim's image.

You have to get up pretty early in the morning to put a challenge to these folks that they can't come back with a winning answer.

What's the prize Pete?

Gary

Gary Priester

Moderator Person

Be It Every So Humble...

[This message was edited by Gary W. Priester on March 12, 2001 at 07:38 AM.]

[glenngosack]

I don't know if this is the easiest way to do it, but the end results "look" right.

Glenn

[pduggan]

Quite a response, eh?

So here's some kind of (hopefully constructive?) interim judgement on what's come in so far. It's a tricky exercise (hope I'm not about to upset anyone!), but I knew we'd see some pretty tidy solutions...

Egg, Christine and Glenn appear to have gone for a 'flat' brush but Joan and myself for changing rotation. Don't know how Karim's was done but, if it's still brush strokes along the lines of the knot, it's mind boggling (it's the only one with no visible joins!). Suppose Gary's is mind boggling too, but mainly for defiantly sidestepping the terms of the challenge...

Egg and Glenn (nice animation, Glenn!) have been pretty successful, but their rope makes me think just a little of cane and basket chairs. Managing the joins is tricky, but Christine's cross-overs are more than a match for her rather lumpy rope.

Changing rotation seems like an attractive way to simulate the lay of the rope, but the joins cause all kinds of problems because you keep ending up with a full 'cross-section' sitting on top of the rope where you don't want it. Joan's obviously adopted a fairly similar solution to myself, but her rope's unravelling a bit in places and there's one join where the lay appears to have been reversed.

Karim's is so tidy I just want to know how it was done! It's also probably the only one with the lay of the rope at a realistic angle...

And my first (Fly) attempt had the rope laid the 'wrong' way round, so I'm attaching my latest effort with changing rotation. I haven't added shadows because I can't get them to work in harmony with the brush strokes, but the joins are hopefully not too excruciating!

So wouldn't it be neat if you could specify whether a line (or segment of a line) passed over or under itself as you drew it? A little challenge for those clever folks at Xara Ltd - it could be impossible for all I know, but it'd sure be a killer function!

Peter</p>

Peat Stack or Pete's Tack?</p>

[This message was edited by Peter Duggan on March 12, 2001 at 03:48 PM.]

[This message was edited by Peter Duggan on March 12, 2001 at 04:04 PM.]

[panfer]

Nice brush Egg. How do you get the ends?
I have seen your brush before but am not sure if you had posted additional info on brush.
These knots are interesting!

[pduggan]

So Glenn suggests in his own challenge that the knot's easy once you get it. Sorry, but I'm not convinced!

'Flat' brushes like Glenn's and Egg's overlap suspiciously on the insides of one curve (RH for Egg's and LH for Glenn's), but 'changing rotation' brushes like Joan's and mine (which take the curves more gracefully) are almost impossible to join because of the unwanted cross-sections. No-one except Karim's yet posted a knot without visible joins, but we don't know how he did it, so surely the jury's still out on this one...

Peter</p>

Peat Stack or Pete's Tack?</p>

[Karim]

Thanks for the praise Pete and Gary, although I may be disqualified if we have to use _only_ brushes [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img] Attached is a .xar file of my knot separated into layers, which indicates my own approach, along with the brush I used. The other entries are very impressive, although no-one's yet taken up my double-figure-of-eight challenge
[img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

Karim

[pduggan]

Of course, of course! I'd tried to cut bits out, but missed this vital step.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Thanks for the praise Pete and Gary, although I may be disqualified if we have to use _only_ brushes<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Disqualified? You kidding? Check out the original terms of the challenge:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Try to draw a figure-of-eight knot (or any other knot if you prefer) in one apparently continuous brush stroke with no obvious joins!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

(The important words being apparently continuous.)

So well done, Karim!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>The other entries are very impressive, although no-one's yet taken up my double-figure-of-eight challenge <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don't worry... I have!

Haven't really got time for this tonight, but I promise to produce a version with a 'rope' brush. If anyone else feels like a go in the meantime, my attachment shows the knot drawn with a very simple brush (not yet converted to shapes, so it can still be edited)...

So how about it, folks?



Peter</p>



Peat Stack or Pete's Tack?</p>

[pduggan]

So I didn't really have time tonight at all, but you know how it is with these things? Can't really justify the effort except as a technical exercise, but the hardest thing in the end was deciding how to colour it in!



Peter</p>



Peat Stack or Pete's Tack?</p>

[Karim]

ok, that was *far* too quick! I thought my challenge was actually very difficult, but you've made it look really easy! Great effect! Now I've just got to get Xara doing this automatically... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

Karim