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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    Prince Edward Island, Canada --- The land of lawn tractors
    Posts
    5,389

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    Steve I'm just saying, like it or not, that is the culture around here as I see it. That culture has developed by the members (and less through moderation) over a relatively long time as this site -when it was the i/us forums- dates from the early days of the public internet. (Back in the days when a 14.4 dial-up modem was state-of-the-art hardware). There are members here who have participated here from those early days.

    Talkgraphics will continue to evolve. If members want to start offering more constructive criticism to others I'd suggest they are welcome to do so.

    Regards, Ross
    Last edited by Ross Macintosh; 12 April 2009 at 01:06 AM. Reason: improving my grammar and spelling

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    North Aurora, Illinois
    Posts
    2,480

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    Thank you Ross. I appreciate the encouragement.
    Things you should never say when pulled over by the police:
    Could you hold my beer while I dig out my license?

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    21,260

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    this has wandered a bit from the topic

    I agree Ross, encouragement is king.....
    -------------------------------
    Nothing lasts forever...

  4. #34

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Frank View Post
    it's obvious all they've done is taken some clipart or a photo and run it or parts of it through successive plug-ins. So if some of us display a certain lack of enthusiasm for that kind of art (yes, of course I accept it is art) then please, try to understand where we are coming from.
    I hear you...
    The other side of the coin of this debate is:
    Try spending 50-100 hours on a manual piece and then to have someone very experienced say... thats obviously an auto trace....

    Thats the flip side of this whole plug-in/advanced function debate...
    There are causalities out there that have never used fancy plug-ins and auto functions ETC and never will....but will none the less suffer because people make off the cuff un-qualified assumptions ETC...

    It is a shame in many ways as each new plug-in effect changes the rules of the game... moving the goal posts much wider apart...

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Hautes Pyrénées, France
    Posts
    5,083

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    Quote Originally Posted by morphonius_821 View Post
    Try spending 50-100 hours on a manual piece and then to have someone very experienced say... thats obviously an auto trace....
    Been there, got the t-shirt. Humbug, humbug, humbug. For an experienced user to say that smells very much of sour grapes. So let them say it (again), I'm not worried, and nor is Javier, I think, after his magnificant Ninja drawing.
    If someone tried to make me dig my own grave I would say No.
    They're going to kill me anyway and I'd love to die the way I lived:
    Avoiding Manual Labour.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    London
    Posts
    230

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    Maya

    Superb painting Really good details and the fire in the eyes. Class work. Well done.

    Sammy

  7. #37

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    I think the underlying emotive fuel of such a debate as this is peoples innate human need to be recognized and applauded for their efforts...and the form such applause takes that causes friction and jealousy.

    I.E... Some people are perhaps more old school and use more manual methods...
    And others can often produce similar results with allot less effort through tools and processes that are more automated and newer etc...
    So i would say it is understandable that these old school folk would resent being sidelined by being put in the same basket as others who are utilizing more automated processes and being compared (often by novices) as if it was and "apples & apples" comparison.... i.e taking a lay look at the results only...

    But i think the real problem is not the plug-in but the desire of the individual to be recognized. If the individual is happy to take the praise of people who can't tell the difference... well i bet they were not complaining when the empty praise was raining down on them and they felt they earned it.
    Now they see the same praise raining down on someone else who they feel didn't work as hard as them and they then resent it....

    I understand it... its human nature...
    but i don't think its a plug-in issue....it goes a little deeper than that.
    its all about peoples emotional investments not paying dividends....LOL

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Ukraine
    Posts
    3,904

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    Hmmmm..... I see the harmony in this forum!
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    John.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    2,675

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life

    I know so what he says.

    I remember the days when you had to write your own script to get an internet connection and then wizards came and everyone could just enter the world wide web. I was appalled.
    And they had floppies, with programs on them , I had to type peek and poke
    for my C=64 and record the end result to a cassette tape.(and find the typo's)

    And cooking, I mean, everything in a jar, and precut vegetables, no more do they have the skill of cutting their own vegetables and meat. And they don`t hunt for their meat or search for their vegetables or mushrooms in the wild.
    It is appalling. And who still builds their own oven or cuts their own firewood
    for cooking? And they live in prebuild homes. No more cutting trees with the added pleasure of the possibility of being crushed by a tree.
    I mean I could go on and on, how we have deteriorated.

    Take arts, no more pen and pencil or brush, and if they still do, who makes
    their own paint from raw ingredients? or goes looking for the ingredients?
    And then computer arts, that undoing if you don`t like it, it is lowering the standards of true artists, with a canvas you have to know what you want to produce for there is no undo button on a blank canvas.(or you must paint one ) So I exactly know the problem he is pointing at
    be aware, not to become a ware.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    21,260

    Default Re: Plug ins and the meaning of life



    in a forum such as these it is natural, and desirable, that there should be debate about techniques

    but the proof for me is always the proof of the pudding - does it do the job it was made for?

    all the rest is introspective ...
    -------------------------------
    Nothing lasts forever...

 

 

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