Are Xara's Pantone colour numbers wrong???

[traceyp]

Hi

My partner and I have recently started looking after a monthly publication for the off-road motorcycle community in the east of England and we have started to brighten up the cover. However, we have also had to change to a new printer who works somewhat differently to our previous printer.

The cover is basically a photo plus black text within two panels of colour which will be different each month and we have been requested to quote the uncoated Pantone colour required. Naturally we turned to XaraX for the reference number but come the time for printing, we had a phone call saying they didn't recognise the colour number. Due to time constraints, they chose a colour nearest to that on the proof we supplied.

On checking XaraX, we found we had quoted the correct number but wondered whether we should have quoted the process colour number. To sort this out, we made an appointment to see someone on the technical aspects of the job today (we had already tried but without success) and we had a good thrashing through what they wanted and particularly colour numbers. They produced their Pantone colour swatch and to our disbelief, the colour refs in XaraX are completely different and bare no relationship to the actual Pantone colours we had to select from during our meeting.

Essentially, I am asking what the uncoated Pantone colour numbers quoted by Xara mean? Are they Xara specific or are they numbers which refer to something else (and I have no idea what!)? Whilst there, we were pointed to Photoshop for genuine Pantone colour numbers and having done so, I find that the colours we originally wanted (according to XaraX) have noticeably different numbers!!! In addition, PS7 shows a series of seven Pantone colours ranges as opposed to Xara's three ranges.

Any advice would be very much appreciated. Thank you.

Tracey

[traceyp]

Hi

My partner and I have recently started looking after a monthly publication for the off-road motorcycle community in the east of England and we have started to brighten up the cover. However, we have also had to change to a new printer who works somewhat differently to our previous printer.

The cover is basically a photo plus black text within two panels of colour which will be different each month and we have been requested to quote the uncoated Pantone colour required. Naturally we turned to XaraX for the reference number but come the time for printing, we had a phone call saying they didn't recognise the colour number. Due to time constraints, they chose a colour nearest to that on the proof we supplied.

On checking XaraX, we found we had quoted the correct number but wondered whether we should have quoted the process colour number. To sort this out, we made an appointment to see someone on the technical aspects of the job today (we had already tried but without success) and we had a good thrashing through what they wanted and particularly colour numbers. They produced their Pantone colour swatch and to our disbelief, the colour refs in XaraX are completely different and bare no relationship to the actual Pantone colours we had to select from during our meeting.

Essentially, I am asking what the uncoated Pantone colour numbers quoted by Xara mean? Are they Xara specific or are they numbers which refer to something else (and I have no idea what!)? Whilst there, we were pointed to Photoshop for genuine Pantone colour numbers and having done so, I find that the colours we originally wanted (according to XaraX) have noticeably different numbers!!! In addition, PS7 shows a series of seven Pantone colours ranges as opposed to Xara's three ranges.

Any advice would be very much appreciated. Thank you.

Tracey

[gwpriester]

Tracey

Pantone specifies two types of color, coated and uncoated. These are essentially the same colors but coated is meant to be printed on a coated stock while uncoated colors are meant to be printed on uncoated stock. Colors printed on coated stock are more saturated and brighter. Colors printed on uncoated stockm which absorbs the ink, are less vibrant. So the Uncoated colors have been compensated to approximate the coated colors.

I hope that makes sense.

In addition, Pantone revises its swatch books from time to time and adds new colors. So it is possible that some of the newer colors will not appear in Xara's palette.

The colors you should be specifying are in the Solid to Process folder. The naming of this folder is confusing at best. It should be called Pantone Spot Colors. These colors correspond to the Pantone Spot Color swatches that your printer has and are also formulated to CMYK values. So if you select a Pantone Spot color from a swatchbook (the best way to select one of these colors) and use the color in a CMYK document, Xara will use the CMYK equivilant of the color.

Bear in mind that not all Pantone colors can be matched in CMYK. Only half will match exactly. 1/4 will be close and the other 1/4 will not be close.

Gary

[gwpriester]

I'm going to guess that the Process Coated and Uncoated DS numbers refer to Digital and probably relate to the Pantone CMYK color swatchbook.

I looked through my collection of swatch books but don't have a process color book.

I know that TruMatch has a process color swatch book that has samples of actual CMYK colors that you can specify in CMYK from the fan book.

Gary

[traceyp]

Gary

I would tend to agree that you would think it would be the spot colours we should be selecting - but NO! Our printer has asked us to select uncoated colours and the colour numbers in the Process Uncoated folder are nothing like the colours numbers they recognise. Hence the confusion.

Even if Pantone do revise their colours and add new ones, the numbering convention would surely follow the existing numbering system for that range of colours. Xara are quoting colours with numbers starting DS. The colours we have to quote comprise just a number followed by U (presumably for uncoated). The only colour numbers starting with DS that I've been able to find (in PS7) is the Process Coated colour range. All other ranges of colours are quoted as "PANTONE xxxx " etc. Where did Xara get the DS range for process uncoated colours? One way or another it had us, and our printers, well and truly fooled and confused.

I've just checked PS7 again and I note that they have not included any Process Uncoated colours. Does this mean that Adobe have not included all the colour ranges available? Just how many colour ranges are there?

Please, I don't want to make too much of this but we know very little about Pantone colours. The last thing we wanted was to think we'd got it right because Xara includes Pantone colours and the approriate numbers - but then find our they do not correspond with the numbers stocked by your printer or even recognised by them!

Tracey

PS: Just posted this message only to find you'd posted another. Gary, we cannot afford a colour swatch. Don't know how much they in the States but here they are very expensive, at a guess perhaps something like 100GBP since they were around 65-70GBP some ten years or so ago. But if there are so many different colour ranges, just how far do you go with swatches. Without doubt, I do find it more than a little confusing!

[covoxer]

Can you give the name of the valid color that you had chosen?

[covoxer]

And I have just found the answer.
Xara has only one Pantone solid color palette. Named 'PANTONE® Solid to Process'.
In fact it is Pantone solid coated palette.
Xara has no Pantone solid uncoated palette.
But the point is that both pantone coated and uncoated palettes represents same coloros but on different paper like Garry had pointed before. So uncoated coloros are much similar to coated but are just a little dimmer...
Anyway all colors that you see in Pantone palettes are only approximation of what they really look like.

Here is salvation for you:
- select color from 'PANTONE® Solid to Process' for your work, but remember that it will be less saturated in reality;
- take it's name from Xara's palette and replace PC with U, example '113 PC' is '113 U';
- give that name to you printer.

This seems to be correct for me. You may give it a try!!!

[covoxer]

And ofcours set 'Show printer colors' in Xara or you'll see nothing that is close to Pantone...