contributing to XaraLX conversion code... proposal

[stuseven]

+ Actually, when this issue came up on the forum... more than
a year ago, I volunteered. Now I want to suggest an answer
which I think will really boost the XaraLX project.
I, and I am sure, many other serious users of XaraLX, do have
some coding experience... so... what we are seeing here is a
"brickwall" situation... those with an interest in helping out, soon
find they are excluded from participating, because they are not
familiar with the code base, and have no real experience in a team
coding project... so... here is my suggestion. Why not open a
special web project, open to capable coders, but the purpose would
be, as much, to educate the interested XaraLX prospective coders...
providing them more obvious jobs... this could even take the form
of a "living coding tutorial", where problems already solved would
be provided as [test questions] for the prospective coders to
solve... but this would be a no-fail proposition to a reasonable
extent... wrong answers would not be failed, but corrected...
and of course, new prospects could officially give up their
involvment at any time.
Im thinking... especially among Linux users of XaraLX (a linux
release, is it not ?), that there must be hundreds of fairly capable
coders who want to help this project, but, again, dont have either
project experience, or experience with the conversion-specific tasks
which still need completion...
...at the simplest level, it's just code, not "magic"... given a few hints,
Id think, easily, fifty or more new coders could quickly learn to make
useful contributions.
So - my parting question will be... is this something any of the remaining principal coders would consider a realistic project to undertake... be
willing to organize, or contribute to ?

end "mega-coder" proposal

[Avatar]

Well, It's a interesting Idea I think..

for example I'm not a coder (just PHP) but I really would like to learn something to be able to help in some way, for example with translations or simple things, as custumizing the keyboard shortcut

[stuseven]

+ for whatever reason, lots of views, but not many replies
to this project suggestion... Im guessing a lot of coders dont
frequent this forum ?

At any rate, I still think my original idea is a good one... as to
how practical it might be, for the group currently producing
new releases, I cant say.

Well, It's a interesting Idea I think..

for example I'm not a coder (just PHP) but I really would like to learn something to be able to help in some way, for example with translations or simple things, as custumizing the keyboard shortcut

[con]

Honestly I think this is a good idea and could possibly be the thing I need to get started, I'm teaching myself C++ at the moment, I know C, python and java from before and I have made some simple programs...but its not just a case of learning a (new) programming language and then start hacking...for instance wxwidgets, while it probably is a very good tool to create GUI's with its not the easiest for someone who hasnt got alot of experience with GUIs compared to something like python and PyQT where you can create a text editor with limited knowledge of how QT (even python for that matter) works...and thats just the tip of the iceberg, theres probably lots of funky code that does incredible things in xara that might more or less require very good math and logic skills too understand, and vector math stuff (not sure its called that in english) ofcourse.

So my conclusion is that even though Xara would be a great project to work on its not very suitable for novice programmers but then again why not. If you would like to go forward with this then I'm in, but with above mentioned stuff in mind.

[Arlen_Albert]

I'm definitely willing to partake in developing XaraLX. And I'm sure I could provide some valuable code to my favorite application.
Sure, If you, stuseven, only dare to organize Xtreme SVN version to work on and are going to coordinate the team. Just let me know. I'm in!

P.S. I mean a separate branch to develop or, if the Xara dev team agreed, to put the source code in a public (restricted) SVN to work all together.

[stuseven]

+ Yep... I discuss some of these problems in my original post...
and the real issue does remain, I believe, this transition from plain
old coding, to the special system employed in the XaraLX code -
so, we agree.
I forsee this as a major new project... still... what is most required
is some direction from the existing project and coders, and further,
as commented yesterday, there is a need for continuity... anything
new has to agree with the major work which has already developed.
+ What I have read about this seems to indicate this is largely
a conversion project... "porting" the old windows version over to
Linux (and now, some other platforms)... however, there is, I think,
room for new features in XaraLX.

It is by no means "my project"... as stated, I dont think a group of
Xara buddies can handle such an undertaking without serious
cooperation and direction by the existing group.

One real issue is whether or not the main coding group ever do
return to this work... last we heard, they had mostly migrated to
help with the commercial version... this may be a lost concern...
it's wonderful to have this pledge of code made available to the
opensource community, but, in fact, we have, quite obviously,
never seen a strictly opensource effort evolve... so... nice if they
return to finish the XaraLX work, or, too bad that it is unreasonable
to expect of these professionals... think about it though... would
you give up your salaried career job if the girl scouts came to
your door and explained how much they could use a full-time
volunteer leader ? I dont think so.

ho hum... long reply here... SO... if and when an opensource
coding group could be organized, we are still looking at the need
for project direction from, what we now see, are actually the
commercial developers themselves... can you say conflict of
interests ? :-)
+ thus, nonetheless, was my original post made, asking about the
practicality of setting up a [coder workshop] which could effectively
pick up the work of finishing, and developing opensource XaraLX.

That will have to end my reply for now... but I think the issue has
been well enough stated... we'll have to wait for news, one way or
the other. The good news is... after they finish their latest
commercial project, we can easily expect that would have time
available for further opensource contributions... but thats what
it is - contributed time and effort... you cant make a living doing
that... it's purely good samaritan work. We will see how it pans out.

Honestly I think this is a good idea and could possibly be the thing I need to get started, I'm teaching myself C++ at the moment, I know C, python and java from before and I have made some simple programs...but its not just a case of learning a (new) programming language and then start hacking...for instance wxwidgets, while it probably is a very good tool to create GUI's with its not the easiest for someone who hasnt got alot of experience with GUIs compared to something like python and PyQT where you can create a text editor with limited knowledge of how QT (even python for that matter) works...and thats just the tip of the iceberg, theres probably lots of funky code that does incredible things in xara that might more or less require very good math and logic skills too understand, and vector math stuff (not sure its called that in english) ofcourse.

So my conclusion is that even though Xara would be a great project to work on its not very suitable for novice programmers but then again why not. If you would like to go forward with this then I'm in, but with above mentioned stuff in mind.

[stuseven]

+ LOL... I do kind of like that title... "the stuseven XaraLX project"...
hmmm... but we'll have to see Arlen !

+I am no more than discussing the practicality of this kind of project...
technically, the code is supposed to be available at this time...
however, the project has already progressed to a near finished
state.
+ I would have to say it's rather impractical to start a project which
would repeat that enormous effort, and dont consider it easily
possible.
+ What I would like to see is a more distinct split between
the opensource XaraLX, and the commercial version. There has
to be something more open to contributions, any way you look at it.

I'm definitely willing to partake in developing XaraLX. And I'm sure I could provide some valuable code to my favorite application.
Sure, If you, stuseven, only dare to organize Xtreme SVN version to work on and are going to coordinate the team. Just let me know. I'm in!

P.S. I mean a separate branch to develop or, if the Xara dev team agreed, to put the source code in a public (restricted) SVN to work all together.

[fjgaude]

All the source code is at:

http://www.xaraxtreme.org/developers/sourcecode.html

All you need is a little direction, i.e., the programmer peckin' order, from Charles Moir or perhaps Alex Bligh and you can be on your way.

frank

[remi]

The best place to discuss these things is the developer mailing list, because you'll find most developers out there and not here. So, please sign up to this mailing list and discuss your questions with the rest of the developers (only a recommendation, because it's more efficient to discuss there).

Regards,
Remi

[Arlen_Albert]

Now, I'm there, talking to devs!