Feedback sought!

[Shaman]

Hi:
Would enoy some feedback on this one.
I've been reflecting on what I actually like about the program, especially versus other graphics apps that I've tried, and would like to hear what other people think.
Let's discount that this is open source, at least for now. It seems as though most are trying to copy Photoshop and Illustrator. I've got to admit, I like Adobe interfaces, at least versus the old (and ex) Macromedia interfaces. And they are feature-rich apps, you betcha'. The downside, from the beginning of my acquaintance with Adobe almost five years ago, was that it did not work the way I thought it should. This is supposed to be faster and more responsive, it's a computer!! I was in Photoshop last night, CS, and decide to lay out a simple illustration. Could not even change the color of a rectangle without deleting (or undoing). And this crazed thing costs $600 plus, U.S. ???!!! I'll grant you, Photoshop is not an illustration app, and does a good job of processing photos. But wow, for all the changes in it, all the bells and whistles, it still has no immediacy, everything takes a minute to process, even on a faster computer. And looking at the filters, I sometimes have to look at the effects I want to apply through a small, thumbnail size image. missing details and often having to redo effects with adjustments, multiple times. Okay, on to Illustrator, better, but still not quite there. Again, not as much immediacy, still some issues with thumbnail-size previews, ugghhh! Enough negatives!
Xara LX, crashes and lockups on occasion, is still faster! Immediacy, feathering, beveling and contouring, these ARE a few of my favorite things! I have been more productive with this program, than any other. And muuchhh better quality! Been good for my creativity. We all like filters and plugins, but I'm finding they can be distracting, and slower for real work and finishing a project.
And finally, I realize that things are fun in any graphics app, but are a real joy in this one, given the responsiveness and abilities of it.
Would be interested in hearing other opinions.
Happy 2007!
Scott

[Intbel]

Photoshop is good for serious editing of photographs.

Illustrator is good for er .... showing how good is

Xara Xtreme which is the only sensible choice for anyone serious about vector drawing/illustration.

Xara Xtreme can, in many instances, be used instead of P'shop for bitmap work.

What worries me is that Adobe may make a hostile take-over bid for Xara and then what?

Scary thought, that ...

[Soquili]

Hello Scott,

Xara Xtreme Linux Edition (formerly Xara LX) is still in development and lacking some features. The most recent version is still 0.7, but by version 1.0 all the features of the Windows Xara Xtreme should be implemented and working as well as the Windows version.

Currently development of the Linux Edition is on hold until the Windows Xtreme Pro version is sent to CD production later this month.

Adobe products have been around and I think were available for the Mac very early on in it's existance. Apple was giving Macs away to schools to build a userbase. Graphics professionals learned to use Adobe products because the schools were using the free Mac (costs supplimented by the US government to support Apple so it did not go out of existance not sure why). Professional graphics designers are not usually computer enthusiasts, they use the tools they learned in school and do not want to change. Therefore Adobe has a dedicated user base.

Freelance Graphics professionals are usually more interested in the tools they use and the computers they work with. They question why the illogic of the Adobe programs makes their lives and jobs harder. Not to degrade the effectiness of the Adobe programs, you can do great work with them. They do have a higher/steeper learning curve than other applications available. Once the user is familiar with all the menus, submenus, pop ups, etc of the program it is ummm....usable and flexable. I cannot say the programs are intuitive to use, but like learning calculus it is usable once mastered.

[jedfrechette]

It's fast.

That's why I like it. When I need to make a more or less freehand illustration Xtreme provides the fastest most intuitative way to do it. However, if I need to make a more precise drawing or edit some bitmaps I usually reach for another tool. As far as I'm concerned most of Xtreme's features that go beyond basic drawing functionality are middle of the road at best. Nice to have for occasional use but not replacements for other more competent tools.

[SorinN]

Hi man

By far, the best vectorial program is Corel Draw(I hope Xara will beat this beast soon).
No Joke.

I'm on DTP industry for more than 10 years. As designer not as a typist. I worked with almost all vectorial / raster apps - for all kind of projects.

Corel Draw - keep the most manageable workflow. UI is customizable.
Vector tools are strong. Print Preview are strong. Spot colors. Lens effects. PDF export. Scripting suport. Linked text frames. U can do all very quick - on large files - because ...speed is better than AI.

Most peoples don't know that - because they don't like to search or to explore.
Most of them tould me AI is a standard on industry - but they don't know to tell me why - they all hear that and they all believe (whatta ...hmm ..easy manageable society).

But the best featured, comprehensive product is Xara. Feather on vectors (kill bill feature), perfect bevel tools - means ART.

Corel is perfect for DTP, Technical Illustrations, etc.
Xara is for Artists.

( ah .. I forget to tell you - I work a lot on Illustrator ( ..where was the only way ) but I never find something "so special" keep me with.. .

[Soquili]

Hi SorinN,

Is Corel planning on an open source vector program to work on Linux platforms?

I believe that is what Scott was interested in by posting in the Xara Xtreme Linux forum.

I could be wrong as he did mention other applications that do not have Linux versions available.

Scott if I am incorrect in my assumption and you prefer I can move this to the Xara Xtreme forum.

[Shaman]

Hi SorinN,

Is Corel planning on an open source vector program to work on Linux platforms?

I believe that is what Scott was interested in by posting in the Xara Xtreme Linux forum.

I could be wrong as he did mention other applications that do not have Linux versions available.

Scott if I am incorrect in my assumption and you prefer I can move this to the Xara Xtreme forum.

Hi Bill:
Was changing distros on my computer yesterday, still have an issue or two but no deal-breakers. That's why I''m slow in replying.
The other apps don't have Linux versions and the discussion I started is mentioning other issues. I'm enjoying and I'm learning which was part of the intent. To clarify;even before I got into graphic design, I enjoyed sitting down with a pad and pencil and drawing. It's meditative, relaxing and just flat out fun! I had some of that when learning to use Illustrator and Photoshop (still do to some extent), but was also frustrated by the way things were done. Don't get me started on how many error messages just on joining two points of a shape I received in Illustrator, even after learning how to do it! Even with crashes, the
errors, the features not yet active, it's faster, it's cleaner, it's better. Not trying to sound overly-anything (pick your adjective o' choice) about this, but I revel in using something this effective, and I've been using Illustrator and Photoshop for five years.
I am hanging out in this section mainly because I'm using LX. The post can stay here as far as I'm concerned. If all the features become enabled or redone I'd tend to view and comment there as much.
Scott

[Soquili]

Hey Scott,

Here in the Linux forum is good.

From what I was reading on a link posted in another thread the Linux version is to have the same code base as the Xtreme Pro version.

It is possible that the open source version may have some of the newest features available when more developers become involved.

[Shaman]

Photoshop is good for serious editing of photographs.

Illustrator is good for er .... showing how good is

Xara Xtreme which is the only sensible choice for anyone serious about vector drawing/illustration.

Xara Xtreme can, in many instances, be used instead of P'shop for bitmap work.

What worries me is that Adobe may make a hostile take-over bid for Xara and then what?

Scary thought, that ...

Hey Raymond:
I'd be willing to try the photo features, looks like it'll have to be a complete re-creation and attempt to match the interface in LX.
Interesting point about the possibility of a buy-out. Last I read, the full code hadn't been released. Still one part to go. What happens if the company that authorizes the code released as open source is bought out, products and all? Can the company that buys (call 'em Adobe, just for fun) pull that code back in, legally?
Can't see Adobe buying the company and then continuing to market the Xara products because they aren't "BIG NAME" industry standards ("snort of dubious disgust inserted here").
This is definitely teaching me that industry standard programs are not always the best or most effective.
Scott

[Shaman]

Hello Scott,

Xara Xtreme Linux Edition (formerly Xara LX) is still in development and lacking some features. The most recent version is still 0.7, but by version 1.0 all the features of the Windows Xara Xtreme should be implemented and working as well as the Windows version.

Currently development of the Linux Edition is on hold until the Windows Xtreme Pro version is sent to CD production later this month.

Adobe products have been around and I think were available for the Mac very early on in it's existance. Apple was giving Macs away to schools to build a userbase. Graphics professionals learned to use Adobe products because the schools were using the free Mac (costs supplimented by the US government to support Apple so it did not go out of existance not sure why). Professional graphics designers are not usually computer enthusiasts, they use the tools they learned in school and do not want to change. Therefore Adobe has a dedicated user base.

Freelance Graphics professionals are usually more interested in the tools they use and the computers they work with. They question why the illogic of the Adobe programs makes their lives and jobs harder. Not to degrade the effectiness of the Adobe programs, you can do great work with them. They do have a higher/steeper learning curve than other applications available. Once the user is familiar with all the menus, submenus, pop ups, etc of the program it is ummm....usable and flexable. I cannot say the programs are intuitive to use, but like learning calculus it is usable once mastered.

Well said, Bill:
Macs were the industry standards for graphics programs for a while, in part for the reasons you mentioned, also because the hardware, the OS (straight gui, versus gui with dos) and maybe the apps that were coming out for the Mac were more geared for graphics. That started to change around 7 years ago (I think). Reed College (I believe it's Steve Jobs' old alma mater) in Portland, Oregon, for instance was a Mac-only network at the beginning of this decade; you lived on-campus and you didn't have a Mac, you couldn't get on with any other system.
I've become a computer enthusiast out of necessity and also out of being interested in the way things work (interfaces, OSes and hardware, oh my!).
If I was currently working for someone else, on their equipment, and wasn't asked for advice or making purchase decisions, I'd smile, shut my mouth and do the job.
A factor that often influences purchase decisions and I don't mean to insult anyone, I feel it's true that many people will eat sand, because they've been told often enough that it's good for them, they are used to eating it and it's all around them. Even when there is delicious fruit near by. The sand-thing was just an analogy that came to mind, borrowed from one of my wife's favorite movies, just think about it.
I know that everyone has their individual preferences. I'm a great admirer of Bert Monroy's among other digital designers and artists. He's used Illustrator and Photoshop for at least a decade, and probably wouldn't change. I follow his methods, but not always the precise tools he uses.
I'm gonna go get some fruit!
Scott