Project Dogwaffle

[smorg]

Has anybody heard of or tried this program? According to nonags.com, it's just out of a 5-year beta state.

http://www.dogwaffle.com/cyberop.htm

[smorg]

Has anybody heard of or tried this program? According to nonags.com, it's just out of a 5-year beta state.

http://www.dogwaffle.com/cyberop.htm

[Soquili]

Hi Smorg,

I downloaded the project dogwaffle and installed it on a Pentium 100MHz Win98 PC. It is very slow responding to mouse movement and clicks on that machine. If it were being used on a 500MHz or faster PC it could be a very nice bitmap graphics program. It has some neat effects, however I think Painter Classic would be a better choice for use on any PC slower than 500MHz.

Soquili

[Steve Newport]

I really like it! Didn't at first, because like you said, it was slow, but if you use their premade natural brushes, it's a very high potential program. But you definentally have to work at it to get good at it! Cool program though

Steve Newport

[gidgit]

There are literally tons of apps out there that offer many fine tools for the creative artist, each app with it's own approach to applying the goods...

However...

When all is said and done, the apps are downloaded and tried out, the verdict, at least in my case, is usually the same...

Stick to the main apps of recognition and choice throughout the industry, while always keeping one eye open for the few gems that do manage to surface from time to time...Like ZBrush for instance...

There are truly only a handful of paint apps that rock...while the rest offer this and that but in all reality all fall short in too many areas to matter much beyond the trials...

1)Painter- this one is a no brainer, by far the most popular paint app on the planet...

2)Deep Paint- I don't really know how many of you have used this stand alone PS plug in, but it really is a top notch paint app... It is my favorite paint app...for now...then there's the next one...

3)ZBrush- is an app unto it's own...the approach in ZBrush is somewhat unique, the scope of this app is huge, and thus, so is the time factor required to become friendly enough with the app so as to move out of the test and toss period and move into the create and it works for you period...but from that point on, there is a pretty good chance that ZBrush becomes the paint app of choice...It's just to powerful of an app not to include into the must have department of your tool box...

4)Expression- wow, very unique indeed...vector painting...this app takes some time to get used to but holds a ton of potential for those who are patient enough to tweak those strokes just so...For me, this is one of those gems that may become very handy from time to time...because unlike PD, Expression offers a approach that is truly unique...

So there ya have it folks, IMHO, it is better to spend your time exploring and practicing with these paint apps, especially the top three, and thus investing your time into your craft, rather than spending your time exploring for apps that might hold a few great tools, but really don't offer near what the industry standard tools do...

Speaking of industry standards, there is always PS v7's new Paint Engine to consider in this category... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

[Gaussian]

Many users just tried out Xara X one day and never went back to Illustrator or Freehand...

[gidgit]

Hi Gaussian, if you had read the thread first before jumping, you would have noticed the part where by I suggested that one always keeping one eye open for those few gems that come along from time to time...

Next,I would have never even thought to include XaraX as an alternative type app as I consider XaraX to be a mainstream industry standard type of app there Gaussian...Yup, right up there in the vector area just as say PhotoImpact is right up there in the image editing area...

hardly to be compared to many of the alternatives that are available but simply do not match up to this fine app... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] and that my friend is the point I was attempting to put across...there are a ton of apps to choose from, but when all is said and done there ends up to be a handful in each category that stand high above the rest, and that IN MY OPINION, people would be better off spending thier hard earned money and equally valuable time learning these choice apps...and hey, in each category there are one or two of these choice apps that come in very reasonable price wise and for the most part perform as well in many tasks as those apps that are supposedly at the very top of the heap...

But, hey, what the heck, you have an opinion and I respect that...Thanx for the input there Gaussian...always fun to share/compare notes with you [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

[This message was edited by gidgit on May 14, 2002 at 21:23.]

eh Canadian, I do understand you [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] , but instead of you I don't have a problem with people who try out something new, but I do have a problem with those who inform numerous people how great a program is, when they just tried it out for a few hours or days.

BTW, what do you mean with "mainstream industry standard type of app", because you bring up Xara X and Photoimpact in that context.

[gidgit]

That description sounds like a certain reviewer who drops into this forum from time to time... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

Hey gaussian, no, I wouldn't tell someone not to try any out, simply suggesting that while they keep an eye open, they spend most of thier time to try and get to know those apps which are already seen by the multitudes as being the best of the bunch in any given category...there is a reason for the opinions of those multitudes ya know...or are they all wrong and you are right?

When I create web graFX for my work I have a select number of apps that I rely on for the brunt of the tasks at hand, as I believe is the norm for most folks in my position...( I am a semi-retired bricky/mason, now a freelance designer, in other words I have built in 3D real world for some twenty plus years, to me building/creating is just that, and tools used are same same...)

and... as far as this goes, whether you are talking about how your tools are organized on the ole work truck for rolling out at the job site, or how they are organized on the desktop for rolling out when creating those things digital, it all is very relative when considering the tasks at hand and the timeframe with which you are working with...which also plays into the tools offered and the workflow allowed by those apps of choice)

As for why I would describe XaraX and or Photo Impact as mainstream industry standards, well...mainly because they are too good to have around not to be deemed as such...they each IMHO have strengths that when called upon, perform the said tasks as quickly and with less fuss than do several apps that some concider to be superior...This to me is where it is at...

mainly because I freelance...I go for the tools that work for me...and generally I have found that those tools that work for me also work for a ton of others...let's just call it a coincidence [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

But hey there gaussian, if you know of any paint apps that match up to Painter, Deep Paint, and or ZBrush, then let's hear about them...(btw, I would consider apps such as Aura, Media Paint etc in a different category...rotoscopers)

If you know an easier program to apply and manipulate shadows, to blend objects or to quickly create a vector shape than XaraX for the footprint of the app and/or the cost, then have at er...

If you know a better, more robust and intuitive all around general purpose graphics editor than Photo Impact, for the price, then I would love to know about it...you should try it some time... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

btw gaussian, I have been using PhotoImpact since version 4...and thus truly feel I am qualified to suggest that not only does this app rock, but that it plays side by side with the rest of the big apps...in fact I would go so far as to suggest that in several areas this app has influenced the growth of a couple of other industry standards...care to debate these points?

Nope, I stand firm in suggesting that while one always keep their eyes open for those few gems, (Swish, ZBrush, Simply 3D to name a few...) it is better to focus ones money, time and energies into learning those proven apps that have managed to earn their way into the hearts of the many...

And for the record,I might add, these standard, well loved apps of which I refer to have provided many jobs through out the industry, from the people who make em, to the people who use them, and thus have enabled micro economies to flourish through out the very communities where all of these people live...from the sales of new computers and other big ticket items, right on to the boosted sales at local corner stores and pizza vendors...and while I am not apposed to new business ventures, they must IMHO make "cents", in all areas concerned... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

[This message was edited by gidgit on May 15, 2002 at 13:06.]

Don't get me wrong Gidgit, I do like Photo Impact (used it for years) and Xara X. Xara X and Photo Impact are both great tools, but they miss things that are really important in a production environment (extended layer support, extended support for colour handling and printing, exchangeable file formats, workflow etc).
The fact is that if I want to use vectors, I use Xara X and if I want a quick logo, I sometimes use Photo Impact, Real-Draw or any other program, but the truth of the matter is, that if a user has to deal with more than a few applications, that same user also has to deal with different environments, which can very time consuming. I'm a networkmanager for many years and I've discovered that it's often more efficient to go for standards. Providing users with a MS Office environment instead of a combination of Wordperfect, Foxpro, Smartdraw and Lotus is just one example. This has nothing to with the fact that these single programs are bad, but with the fact that there's less integration. One can't compare a single user preference, with what a company wants. A company also has to deal at the educational aspects, exchangeability (in and outside the company) and workflow. You see this happening in any major software company. Take for example Adobe and Macromedia. They both focus on tight integration and a better work flow.
Even when I'm at home I still try to focus mostly on this widely spread software, because it gives me the knowledge that I need for my work. This doesn't mean however that I don't work with any of these other applications.
Now another example; I’ve used Cinema 4D, great program, rock solid, fast and user-friendly, but it's very hard to keep my interest, when there isn't a lot of information available. To my knowledge only two books have been published for this program, so I'm forced to browse forums and the internet which can be very time-consuming and that wouldn't leave me enough time to spend with my family. Have you ever tried out a Photoshop tutorial on the internet with Photoshop running? Nah, I rather have a book.
For a program like Xara X the knowledge has to be gathered by means of the internet.
This was also the case with Linux years ago. That’s why many new companies started to provide personal support. Nowadays it’s also easy to take a Linux course at many educational institutes.
Yes, sometimes I am really frustrated that certain things can be done many times faster in Photo Impact than in Photoshop, but that is sometimes also the other way around. The truth is that NO program will ever suit all needs. I have choices to make and so have you.
No program will make you an artist, but when it comes to other aspects that I talked about earlier (integration, work flow, standards, compatibility, educational aspects etc), you’re sometimes forced to balance the pros and cons to find the best solution for that particular purpose. So, please, please Gidget, don’t get me wrong. I’m not trying to flame in any way about any program; I just wanted to explain that different problems sometimes ask for different approaches.