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Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Am I correct in sensing an increasing lack of interest in Xara products? Less posts, fewer new threads, like that? Not just on TG, but on Xara-Users also?
If so, why? Assuming that there is a constant market for graphics software, where are the artists going? Are there viable commercial art apps for tablets that I'm just unaware of? Or has the extremely expensive trio of Illustrator, Photoshop, and Dreamweaver made our Xara products obsolete? Somehow I can't imagine that.
Or -- do you think younger people might be moving more into video production and wireframe animation, and moving away from print and web development artwork?
Any opinions?
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Well I've just joined the forum and I'm a big fan of Xara, I fond designer pro x a fantastic product!
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Adam -- yes, it IS fantastic. You can get so much done with it, so fast. I've used it for years -- at work before I retired, and now for personal art and photo editing. Started this thread, though, because I think interest is falling off, and I'm curious why... since software like Designer Pro is faster, better... and a LOT less expensive than the usual suspects!
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Very good observation Jon, I have noticed this as well, particularly in the web gallery. I think it would be wrong to assume that xara products are used by professionals, and that is not because the products are not upto it, it is simply that in colleges/universities it is adobe products which dominate and this flows into graphic design businesses, all our designers use adobe products.
I have only used webdesigner from xara so I can't really comment on the suitability of the other programs for professional work, but I have been lucky to come across webdesigner a couple of years ago and business has been good (120+ websites so far) but even now we do more work with wordpress as more and more clients demand features such as cms, which as we all now is not something which is viable with xara.
Also I feel that with the recent release of webdesigner (9) there is nothing earth shattering, very akin to apple's myriad releases of the iphone; polish it a little and improve what it already does. If new users are to attracted to the product their needs to be a much more current offering from xara. Just look at the offering for some of the other software companies such as wysiwyg web builder which now has cms built in.
I remember when I first joined this forum there seemed to be far more new threads and I too have noticed a lull, hopefully it is just a short-term problem.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
i am a fairly new xara user.. have it for about just over a month now! but i can say what bugs me.. is buying the program! an then having to buy additional widget packages.... i mean really.. thats money grabbing. i use adobe photoshop for my art work.. an then web designer for my web site creation.. but it just bugs me that you need to pay for stuff like widgets.. its like buying a car an then being told you need to pay extra to get the tires..
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
There are a range of widgets already provided within Web Designer Premium in the Designs Gallery under Page Elements > Photos > Photo Slideshow (widgets).
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
"Lack of interest" crtainly not I. But I also have noticed a decline in user participation in these forums. I don't know if it's a lack of interest in Xara products though. I think it may be more like people just don't want to spend their time here for whatever reason. I for one would like to see this place return to the vibrant community it used to be. We have a huge number of members world wide but only a handful take the interest or time to participate.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
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Originally Posted by
Southafrican
what bugs me.. is buying the program! an then having to buy additional widget packages.
You don't have to. It's not necessary, it's your choice.
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i use adobe photoshop for my art work.. an then web designer for my web site creation
And the retail cost of photoshop vs XWD is... ?
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its like buying a car an then being told you need to pay extra to get the tires..
No, it's like buying a car then expecting the manufacturer to pay out for a custom paint job, dangling dice and blue leds.
Xara is everything you need. If you want to take shortcuts you can pony up more cash.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
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Originally Posted by
wizard509
"Lack of interest" crtainly not I. But I also have noticed a decline in user participation in these forums. I don't know if it's a lack of interest in Xara products though. I think it may be more like people just don't want to spend their time here for whatever reason. I for one would like to see this place return to the vibrant community it used to be. We have a huge number of members world wide but only a handful take the interest or time to participate.
For myself, the decline in participation are factors out of my control (more or less). Just finished a catalog publishing gig, some contract work, trying to make up time/work/money from the period I took care of my mom, and it is simply getting nice outside. So the garden work and other outdoor activities intrude on my time. I would think the warming weather plays into other people's time, too.
Mike
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
the warming weather
A ton of people on TG are wondering what on earth you are talking about!
I think half the USA has snow and the other half has sun. We've had loads of snow and cold weather in the UK and Europe.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
I do not think that there would be lack of interest of Xara, the Designer Pro X is that version already where people can feel all in one. With more opportunities than idea can come for someone.
Rather I think during the years so lot of good tutorials are that the questioned information typically can be found somewhere, on Xaraxone, in Outsider tutorials, on Talkgraphics or Xara-Users. Or on Youtube channels like Xaraxone, Xhris, Angelize, Sledger, bcire68 etc. have, great materials really.
Inspite of those tutorials I used to ask relatively often :)
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
First I have moved this to Off Topic as this seems better suited to an off topic discussion.
There are probably a lot of reasons why participation on the forums seem to ebb and flow. The changing seasons are just one of them. There are indeed some areas of North America's west coast where spring has arrived Paul :) Even here in British Columbia the weather has begun to get warmer (not much drier yet, but warmer ;)) )
There is quite a lot of activity right now in the Xara Web design forum with the release of WD9 and there will be an increase in activity in the Xara graphic chat forum later this summer when the next version of DP comes out.
If you want to see more activity in a certain area of the forum start something ;) For example if you would like to see a discussion about text effects open a thread in the Xara graphics chat forum, maybe post an example and invite others to join in.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
whilst discussion of TG is maybe off topic forum, the very first question asked:
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Am I correct in sensing an increasing lack of interest in Xara products
is surely a Xara related question and not an off topic one...
these things go in cycles... do a search you will see comments similar in 2007 and 2002 and quite possibly other years as well....
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
The pricipal reason to join a forum dedicated to a piece of software, particularly if you are a new user, is to ask a 'how too' question. If you search that question you can usually find an answer with out have to post the question so maybe may posts maybe dont get made because there is such a large resource of information, answers and how too videos available.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
I have to admit I was not blown away when I first saw the list of new and improved features in WD Premium 9. But after working with it to write my First Look (Xara Xone), and after bringing some old sites into WD Premium 9 for updates and facelifts, I have to say, there is no going back. There are more than enough new and improved features to make the upgrade worthwhile. Top on my list of likes are the Google Web fonts with the built-in Google fonts browser, and the tremendously simplified publishing. No more browsing down and down and down through the layers trying to remember where you last published your site to on your computer. The new backgrounds are great and add a lot of style and class. Retina display resolution is great for designing for mobile devices. And I could but won't go on and on.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
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Originally Posted by
gwpriester
No more browsing down and down and down through the layers trying to remember where you last published your site to on your computer.
Please could you explain. My copies of WD9Premium do not remember where I exported/published my site to on my computer.
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Retina display resolution is great for designing for mobile devices.
How exactly do larger resolution images assist in designing for mobile devices?
I don't understand why this thread is considered an off-topic one either. Quite clearly it is related to Xara software.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
picking up on that first question in post #1 [which is indeed the thread title] .. I don't see any evidence of that, given that vector drawing is a minority sport outside of design, and xara is a niche product [can't comment on the web building]
to be honest if xara was taught in schools you would get a few more individuals on board, but the lack of virtually any corporate/team orientated features means it isn't going to break into that market anytime soon
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
This thread was moved into off topic from Xara Graphics as it is not specifically related to creating graphics but rather a more general discussion of interest in any Xara product in relation to activity on the forums. I think its perfectly fine here :)
I use Xara on a daily basis for page and layout work for print and web and web design. I think that there is a lack of knowledge about Xara programs here in North America, most designers only know about Adobe and I've even come across a few who think I am not a "real designer" because I choose not to use Adobe products if I can help it.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
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Originally Posted by
angelize
I think its perfectly fine here :)
Perhaps you do, but the point is many Xara users never visit the Off Topic forum and will miss out having their say in relation to Xara products as a result, which is what this thread is about.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
a few who think I am not a "real designer" because I choose not to use Adobe products
That is the prevalent feeling in the industry. I understand why people feel that way. Adobe has become the common currency of design houses and anyone who wishes to work in a professional design studio will be expected to know how to use Adobe software. Ergo, if you don't use Adobe software you won't look like a "real designer".
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
@Frances - in that case it would have been better in Graphics Chat, which is the place to discuss graphic topics which do not have their own forum [so say it in the blurb] - and not off topic, which is not supposed to be for graphics chat
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
because it is about the popularity of xara software and not simply:
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a more general discussion of interest in any Xara product in relation to activity on the forums
read the first post again
unless of course the powers that be want to pretend otherwise...
[sorry for double post - clicked wrong button yet again :rolleyes:]
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
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unless of course the powers that be want to pretend otherwise...
Well, what did our President say during the campaign? 'You can't perfume a pig?' Something like that. The problem here is that XDP and P&GD are definitely not pigs, but, even worse, it seems that no-one even knows they exist. And that's before you get into the moving target of younger people running off the cliff with their useless little tablets.
So perhaps it all comes down to marketing, and buzz. Like, I saw Justin Bieber using Xara last week at St.Moritz! Dude! And, are there ANY testimonials from anybody currently working for a Fortune 100 company? Or anybody in Hollywood? Anybody?
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
the moving target of younger people running off the cliff with their useless little tablets.
What the heck does that mean? I know plenty of not-so-younger people that are very happy with their tablets (and no, I don't mean medicinal ones).
Are there ANY testimonials from anybody currently working for a Fortune 100 company?
Fortune 100 companies, certainly won't be using Xara software, except in some small forgotten enclave.
Xara software is not about corporate use, it's a consumer level product with professional features usable by small design setups.
It is not on an equal footing to the Adobe Creative Suite.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
@Jon
in my experience more young people are interested in art than design, and that means raster not vector by and large
maybe if xara had brushes like serif... but I've been going on about brushes in xara for half a decade or so....
FWIW pigs don't smell bad in their natural environment.. so maybe there is another metaphor there somewhere :D
@Paul
well I can certainly relate to that because it's a symbol in some circles of the decline of civilisation - the evolutionary progression of mankind from the fish dragging itself out of the water through the various stages, right up to homo sapiens so busy talking on the mobile rather than looking where he's going that he walks straight off the cliff edge...
[but I wouldn't go so far as to say tablets are useless, they're not]
EDIT - and before I get grief - anyone that daft would be a 'he' .....:p
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Before retiring, I got Xara on the 'approved software' list for my workgroup at Qualcomm Corp. in San Diego, California. A large Fortune 100 company... designs the computer chips in your smartphones. We were getting killed by Adobe pricing... even with the discounts you get for corporate purchases. Xara is faster, cheaper, better. Look -- for 99% of in-house work... web, e-learning, and print (we had our own print shops with Kodak and Xerox color digital printers) -- you just don't NEED Photoshop or Illustrator. In-house is NOT an external ad agency. The artwork is NOT complex. But -- ran into resistance from co-workers who feared they would, if laid off in the recession, be less employable if not up-to-date on the latest Adobe products.
Tablets -- how on earth can I make an ad or a brochure or a website on a tablet? For expressing myself, sure. For fine art, you bet. Swipes and gestures to unlock my creative powers? Why not? But then, for $20, I can buy a set of fingerpaint colors and some suitable paper, and get back to 6 years old. When, like EVERY little kid on this planet, I was a truly fine artist!
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Windows Surface Pro is a tablet and you will be able to install Xara Designer on it then use your wireless mouse and keyboard.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Maybe I am one of those people who have disappeared! I use XDP most days but I don't often do anything new with it. Generally it is straightforward stuff - a poster, to crop a jpg, or maybe a diagram. Once in a while I have a 1 or 2 page website where the client really doesn't want something clever or expensive - and then XDP does the job.
I will probably get the upgrade with the new things in it (I presume they will end up in XDP) and I will lurk here a bit until I learn enough - and can chip in to help others.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
I think very few large companies would go near Xara. These days companies don't stand in isolation and Adobe (forget the file format) is the exchange medium - for files and ideas. I have worked for a fair few companies and nothing but Adobe software has been used officially, except for other specialised software.
Jon, you sound as though you've found your fortune 100 company to endorse Xara. Go make it happen.
Tablets. There's more to computers than creating complex artwork and tablets aren't replacements for desktops but that makes them far from useless. Don't make your brochure or website on a tablet. Use it for something else (unless of course, you have a windows tablet!).
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
just read an interesting article [which I have mislaid link to darn] that makes the point that there are two reasons for PC sales declining - one is the shift in consumer purchases, two is the reliability of modern computers, and the fact [they say] that PC hardware is no longer improving by leaps and bounds, so there is no need to replace it so often, especially given the stability and speed of win7 - and although PC sales have stalled, sales of netbooks, which are essentially mini-PC's are actually increasing ...
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
I've been looking at the surface pro and the main reason is that I'd be able to install and use Xara software on it. My thoughts are it would be great for sales calls, I could show a client their ad on the spot and make edits as we discuss them. Its difficult to carry around and set up a full sized laptop for a quick meeting with a client in a store. Right now it's the price tag $999.99 CAD and other expenses that keep cropping up that are holding me back
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
My stepson came down today from Hollywood. Talked about this with him. In the entertainment world, it's smart phones and tablets. He says computers are used in post-production, but tablets are doing the job for most everyone else. And, he says, why not, since most people have no need for an actual computer? Which set me off on a rant about how if younger people don't have skills, they'll lose out... and he replied that they all believe they have the skills, since they can look anything up on Google, and this works OK until they actually have to produce something. And he replied that our manufacturing sector jobs have gone from 24% to 8% over the last ten years, so it's not like they have to learn very much to get the service sector jobs that are left. Just get a degree in Communications or something equally meaningless, like Gender Studies.
We both agreed that our most popular tools say something about our society, and as long as we can get by selling little electrical gadgets to each other, we can keep the ball in the air. As for Xara products, here's hoping the Surface Pro drops in price! Too bad they didn't put real Windows on the cheap one.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
A lot of non-manufacturing jobs are also moving east. I know that in the creative industry a lot of 3D and special-effects houses have been downsized or folded in US and that comes from a mixture of drop in demand/increased efficiency/moving to lower cost economies outside the US.
There is a huge dependence on on Asian economies in manufacturing these days by the west.
Communication skills may be more applicable than manufacturing skills at the moment in the US. There's little point in anyone coming out of education these days with a manufacturing skill if the manufacturers are all in Asia.
3D printers look like they will provide a bit of a manufacturing re-birth - bringing down the costs involved in creating prototypes. The world is changing fast.
Gender studies? Hmm. I thought everyone did that as a hobby.. ;-)
I think the west needs to get it's manufacturing mojo back and this is all now heading far off-topic.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Well, I am certainly not losing my interest in Xara, but I have been somewhat busy lately.
I sort of rebuild my house: stripped my living room and my bathroom - put in new wiring, plumbing (yes even in the living room, to get hot and cold water upstairs), installing a new bath - with jets :), plastering, wall and floor tiling, new ceiling in the bathroom and restoring the ceiling in the living room to show more of the old wooden timber (old-ish farm house :) ) et cetera. Still need some time to paint and have to put in a new wooden floor.
Next to that, I have a 40 hrs/week job, am the family cook (yes, that includes groceries ;) ), accountant, part-time housewife (e.g. I wash and iron my own clothes), dog trainer, janitor, handyman, gardener of a 1000 m2 garden, poolboy, father of 5, husband of 1 ;), volunteer at a Buddhist institute in the Netherlands (helping out on stuff like rebuilding their new place, designing decorations, attending work shops)... oh and of course digital thangka painter ;)
In my spare time, I redecorated my thangka work shop, just for the fun of it ;) so I can now use it as a small meditation centre as well.
In the near future, I might be giving some courses on digital Thangka drawing, using Xara. Will keep you posted!
I know, not much of an excuse :P
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Isn`t a part of the new users in Magix sites? Since they have 'taken over' Xara. So the same line of product also exists now under the namebrand Magix. Or are these new users redirected to this site too?
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
I believe that without taking a fairly comprehensive survey, it’s impossible to definitively state that people are or aren’t losing interest in Xara products.
On one hand, if you judge a product solely on how effective the marketing is, I’d venture that the design software we call Xara is in stronger hands with MAGIX than it was with The Xara Group, whose core competence can be argued to be engineering, although they did very, very well all on their own for more than a decade. Marketing—selling a product—has its own skill set, and all you have to do is look around at other products to accept this. Many, many terrific products have fallen by the wayside due to lack of marketing muscle.
On the other hand, with only a few exceptions such as Poser, a software that has survived four ownerships, most products have a life as strong and as long as the company that makes the product. And companies, like governments, exhibit one of two growth models over time. There’s the ebb and flow model, which Microsoft goes through—first they’re popular, then they lag behind, then they come back stronger. Then there’s the life cycle model: the rise and fall, typewriter companies, companies that depended on carcinogens in their recipes, and companies that just did a slow-motion suicide due to inept management. Looking back to the first day I used Xara in 1995 (I think), I’d say the company is in a stronger position today, and that it appears to have a long-term ebb and flow model as businesses go.
Do I think people are losing interest in Xara? Me? No. I wouldn’t be writing this if I felt disinterested. Xara has two very strong things going for it: price, and speed. The world is never going to run out of novices, or “accidental art directors” at small businesses. For these people, Xara is top shelf when they’re comparing it to image software at Walmart or in the Tiger Direct catalog. And for people who have been using a PC for more than 20 years and know their way around programs, Xara fills a “bang per buck” criterion when you’re looking for a design program that isn't in a suite that costs thousands of dollars, that has good community support and documentation, and that has more than 75% of the tools you need to get a day's work done. You stay in a program=you get work done faster.
Finally, the new coin of the realm is Time, not Money. When you have more time, you can always make more money. But you can do neither if a program has “feature-it is”. You don’t have to dig through submenus and sub-submenus in Xara, and you don’t need three different tools to create a curved spline.
I think “The Press” might be eclipsing the interest in Xara, not in reality, but in the amount of advertising a company with the resources like Adobe Systems can throw out here. It’s very hard to hear the quiet voices of artists who earn their daily bread with Xara, when Photoshop has become a verb (to create an illusion in a photograph) we hear in movies, read in newspapers, and accept as a mainstream software, like Windows.
I’ll wait patiently until MAGIX gives a serious public reply to the ugly true-ism a lot of us use to describe Xara: it’s the greatest little design program no one has ever heard of.
—g
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Initially I had been impressed with the easy of use, cost and quality of Xara WD 6-7-8 but the program is turning me off because to keep up with stuff like Wordpress and Joomla you have buy updates and add-on tools. Also, no Mac version is ridiculous to say the least. A huge number of Mac Based Designers would jump on board and add XARA to our tool list. I use it under Bootcamp and Parallels but Windows is so clumsy for graphic design I keep looking of alternatives.
Don't get me wrong I want to love XARA, but I feel unrewarded for my loyalty so far. Why can't I get occasional free updates to WD premium for instance? Why isn't WD9 around $20 for customers who have upgraded each year?
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
I want to love XARA, but I feel unrewarded for my loyalty so far.
Loyalty? I think you might have bought it because it's good software at a good price.
the program is turning me off because to keep up with stuff like Wordpress and Joomla you have buy updates and add-on tools.
What updates and tools do you need to buy?
Windows is so clumsy for graphic design
That's something I've never heard before, from anyone. I run Xara under parallels.
Why isn't WD9 around $20 for customers who have upgraded each year?
Probably because their developers like to be paid.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
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Originally Posted by
fostermedia
...Why isn't WD9 around $20 for customers who have upgraded each year?
Maybe a sliding scale of costs, to reward those who purchased previous versions?!
That way, you keep loyalty, if that's worth something to the company.
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Re: Are people losing interest in Xara products?
Xara already discounts upgrades, isn't that incentive enough to "stick with the programme".
Software development is expensive and $20 - what can you buy with that?
If I was at Xara HQ and heard that users thought the efforts of their development over the last year was worth $20, I'd think that was pretty insulting.