Need help exporting Logo

Hi everybody,

I am pulling my hair (what's left of it) but I can't seem to get this to work.
Then again, I am everything but an expert when it comes to printing.

The problem:
I made a logo for a client. And for the first time, the logo does not contain only flat colors but is sort of "3D". I enclose the part that gives me the worries, the text part below is working fine, so no need to include it.

1) I can't - for the love of it - export this properly as PDF or EPS. When exporting as PDF, he final result looks horrible. When exporting as EPS, I can't open it, Photoshop says it contains errors. I NEVER had that before!

I can work around this problem, by exporting the logo as a bitmap (which works) and that is possibly not a big problem. However, a resolution-independend vector-version would be the best solution.

2) The main problem!
The logo will be printed in 2c, with black and a Spot Color HKS60N (I put the CMYK-expression of it into the file). I used a "Tint" of the Spot Color as the highlight, so it would be the same color, only lighter.

ALL the colors are defined as CMYK, however the "grey ball" ALWAYS is exported on the C, M, and Y - plates with the black one being nearly empty.


Could anybody help me - especially with problem 2 - please ??
I am sure I am just doing something wrong, but I can't seem to find out what?

Here's a preview of the drawing in question, as well as the .xar

Thanks !!

Wolfgang

Edit: I am using XXPro 4 !!
Maybe somebody could just give it a try in version 5 ??

Exported in Xtreme 5, seems OK.
Nice graphic, by the way, Holger.
Saludos,
Bob.

Bob,

that's amazing!
I never would have thought that 5 would make such a big difference to 4.

In the PDF it does not really look like it's supposed to, but I could fix that.
My own output (from XXP4) is totally wrong and totally unusuable, it makes no difference if I export as PDF from Xara or print via Acrobat.

Could I even have the output in 2C with 5 as well ??
I tried using Spot-Colors in XXP4 as well, but it just won't work ...

I'd highly appreciate the input of a Pro in the 2C-matter ... like I said I have little experience in print ...

Anyway, big thanks to you Bob, maybe the time to upgrade to 5 has finally come for me ... ?

Wolfgang


Edit: I just checked Bob's PDF in Photoshop and it opens brilliantly !!!!
However, it's still 4 colors, not 2 :-(

Feathers and shadows are always exported to PDF like bitmaps.

Also Im not so sure did illustrator for example will understand correct eliptical fill.... circular Ok, but elliptical :rolleyes:

So your decision is to simplify the things.... :D

I mean, shadow for example have to be created like blend from two ellipses... no problem to use position profile adjustments....
reflexes can be done like inside contours from biggest shape....
shadow over green have to be created from two shapes and blend tool, here important is to give "overprint fill" to blend, which will "see" spot under blend trough black color

And another important, if you want your HKS to be treated like spot, you have to create it like spot/named color

Attached are reworked xar
also preview of separation in acrobat
and of course pdf

Cheers :)

The logo is going to eventually be rasterized, before it is printed, so the best and safest solution with this kind of image is to make it a bitmap. If it converts to a bitmap without problems then you are in good shape.

Very handsome design, by the way. :)

Bob - Holger? Wrong thread. This is Wolfgang. :o

@Minimiro
Thank you so so much for your help and insight.
I learned a LOT from your post, I never even saw the "overprint"-option on objects.

I worked a little on you version of the logo already, but it does not quite look like my version yet. However, I am confident that I can get it there.

Still, I can't export in 2 colors only, whatever I try, but I will speak with the printers tomorrow, maybe it won't make such a big difference after all ...
The 2 colors were my idea in the first place (to save printing cost), but if it has to be 4c, it just hast has to be ...

@Gary
Really good to hear from you again!

Last week I already told the client that I will deliver the logo in a bitmap-format only (which works perfectly). And in different sizes of course.
Still, if there is any way I could get it in vector format (and I believe, it's possible with Minimiro's version and maybe using XXP5 instead of my XXP4 for exporting), it would be so much more convenient than having to export in multiple sizes.

Thanks four your kind words regarding the design as well.

If anybody is interested: The old (and totally different) logo of the client had a green checkmark in it that they generally wanted to keep. Of course the old one was the one you'll get with the Wingdings-font ...

The version above is my interpretation of the checkmark and the client decided on it against ~15 other designs.
Below the sphere is the company name, but I did not include it here since it did not make any problems.

Wolfgang

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gwpriester

Bob - Holger? Wrong thread. This is Wolfgang. :o

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Right thread, wrong name!

Apologies, Wolfgang, still I did get it right in the Private Message. ;)
Saludos,
Bob.

No worries Bob,

I have been called worse things than just "Holger" ;-)

Wolfgang

Sadly, I need to be back, asking for help ...

I took Minimiro's "logohelped.xar" and did a little work on it, always careful not to change the order of things, nor the settings of overprint and all.

I even installed the XXP5P trial on an old PC to see if it makes any difference. It does not.

Problem is: The logo now exports fine vector-wise.
Meaning: If I export to PDF and then open it in Photoshop, it LOOKS like it should on screen.

But while black is on it's own plate, the spot-color isn't.
Then again, it opens as a CMYK and probably it just *can't* display it as 2 colors in this mode?

Calling the experts in color separation here, is the included file indeed 2c (and I am just doing something wrong) or is it really CMYK and not 2c ??
Can you open it in Photoshop, so it shows as a 2 colors only?

Sorry I can't figure it out myself, but somehow this logo seemst to be different than all the ones I made before ...

Wolfgang

Photoshop cant direct to open pantone PDFs
Everything will be recalculated to CMYK

Your decision to make photoshop file with pantone chanell is change temporary pantone in Xtreme with Cyan for example, export it, open it in photoshop, then copy in clipboard (Ctrl+A->Ctrl+C) only Cyan chanell, now create new pantone chanell in file with needed color and paste copied info from Cyan, than delete everything in Cyan... and you are ready :)

One important thing, photoshop PSD file is only one format which preserve information for spot/pantone channels, so save and sent in PSD

Thanks once again for clarification Minimiro!

But what if I send the enclosed file (the PDF above) to the printers?
Will THEY be able to open it as 2 colors or not?

I mean, is this only a Photoshop-thingie and the printers will do it totally different or will they have "just" a CMYK-file too ??

btw: I sent the PDF to the printers, asking just that, but have not gotten an answer yet.
Commercial companies ALWAYS act way slower than the Talkgraphics-community ;-)

Wolfgang

PDF is only with 2 colors (if everything is made right ;) )

If they try to open PDF with photoshop, this will be first print company which try to open and edit PDF trought Pshop :))))

Alright, that's what I needed to hear...
Still no answer from the printers of course, but this gives me hope!

Thank you once again!

Wolfgang

Wolfgang why get hung up in the 2 spot colours? In my experience the difference in a larger run, over 5,000, is not a very large price difference. Any runs under 1000 it is not worth using that type of printing in a normal layout then they would just use a laser printer using 4 colours again. All of this is current information on the two printing firms that I use in Scotland.

Hi Albacore,

generally, you are absolutely right!

However, it's a bit different this time.
My client (whom I made the logo for) is a tax accountant.

One of HIS clients is this rather small printing company.
And that's why everything will be printed there.
Sadly, they only have a 1-color printing machine and that's why in this case it makes a real difference.

Sometimes the reasons are not only technical ... ;-)

On another note, I just got info from the printers that they can NOT color-separate the logo to two colors. Black is fine, but the "spot color" spreads over all plates.

It seems, that Xara ALWAYS introduces new colors in gradients, even if the basic colors are defined as spot?

Or am I still doing something wrong ??
I now exported from Xara (4) in every vector-format there is and sent it to them.
Maybe they can use one of those other versions ...

Is there any difference in the ai/eps-export modules of XXP4 and XXP5 that anybody would know of?
My 5-trial is still working, so if it makes a difference I could try exporting with the newer version.

Any other tipps how I could restrict gradients to TWO colors (plates) only ??

Guys, even if I am not around that often anymore, I still would not know what to do without Talkgraphics!


Wolfgang

By definition, isn't a spot color a pure color? Therefore, the only way to make a gradient into a pure color is to do the screening yourself? As an example, here is the white portion of your graphic using one screen technique. (Actually, it isn't really a screen, but it is the best I can do quickly.)

David

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wolfgang

........I just got info from the printers that they can NOT color-separate the logo to two colors. Black is fine, but the "spot color" spreads over all plates.

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Is it possible, to sent me your PDF which they cant separate, to see what you made there?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by minimiro

Is it possible, to sent me your PDF which they cant separate, to see what you made there?

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I just sent the file to the E-mail given on your homepage.
If you find anything to fix this, it would help me a lot!

Thank you so much

Wolfgang

Success !!!!

I just got a call from the printers and it finally works perfectly, color separation and all!

All my thanks go to minimiro, I could not have done it without you!
Sorry for being a bit thick when interpreting your instructions, and thanks for your patience!

Wolfgang

:)



.............

Hi Guys,
I'm curious, what was the solution?
Regards,
Frits

Hi Frits,

I can only answer what the solution for the general exporting problem was.
All Transparencies, Feathering and some Fills (elliptical in this case) were converted to simple objects and blends.

Looks the same, but also exports real fine.
And I am not saying I did that ... it was Minimiro's magic.

About the 2-color problem I had, I can't really explain the solution.
To be honest, I still don't get how it can look totally "wrong" on the screen, but perfect when exported. And I am not talking about simple differences in screen/printer colors.
It's really something else, you can get Minimiro's attached .xar and check for yourself.

Minimiro:
If you ever find time, maybe you could do a short tutorial on the hows and whys of this case?

Wolfgang