PDF/x anomalies

Hello all,

I'm a long time Xara 3.2 user and am trial-ing V4 Pro. My main interest is being able to export PDF/x out of Xara without going through PS. My first test exports look good with one exception. I have some PNG pictures with transparent areas and lines created in Xara that run behind them, and in all my PDF/x tests, the lines render as offset where the PNG overlaps them. I've tried turning the lines in to shapes to no effect. If I export as PSD, import into PS, and then export as PDF/x from there, (like I've been doing from Xara 3.2) it doesn't happen. Any ideas? If I can't get this to work then I really don't need the Pro version.

Any help or suggestions are appreciated,

Scott

Hi Scott,

Could you upload an example .xar?

I can't upload the real file because it's proprietary, but I made an example file. I've noticed this doesn't happen in smaller files, and it's more prominent in the file I can't post, but if you export the attached/uploaded file as PDF/x and zoom in on the bottoms of the orange rectangles where the bowl of food overlaps you see a jog in the line. The jogs I'm getting out of my big file are even more pronounce. I also tried copy/pasting all the content to a new file thinking there might be something wrong with the file itself, but that didn't help either.

Thanks for looking,

Scott

Scott are you setting any Advanced Options when exporting to PDF/X?

I would like to make some tests using the same if any options you are setting.

Thanks.

No, I am just using the "commercial printing" setting and not changing anything else. I did try tweaking the settings, but that had no effect.

Scott

Thanks Scott.

From the few tests I've made the jog occurs where the png image overlaps the rectangle.

I'll have to postpone more tests until I get off work in the morning. I work 3rd shift. :eek:

Yikes! Thanks for looking. And yes, I noticed that it's where the PNG with transparant areas overlaps the line. But if you take just one of those food bowl and rectangles and put it in a file by itself and export as PDF/x you don't get the jog = gets worse the larger/complex the file.

Cheers, Scott

scottmcll,

I see your point.

The difference is Xtreme render your image with shadow as a bitmap but trying to stay with your rectangle as vector. But by the nature of PDF/x, all transparencies should be rendered as a bitmap with no transparencies ).

When you are exporting as PSD, your image include your shadow. So in AI your image and its shadow is the one object.

When exporting from Xtreme, your shadow is rendered as separate object etc.

See attached files.

The first is your PDF/x (I added dark background) in the AI -- we have 4 objects -- shadow, rectangle fill, rectangle stroke, your image. Notice the piece of your rectangle with orange stroke under your image -- this thing I was trying to explain ))) -- this is rasterization of transparent areas when PDF/x.

Now, the solution -- you have to convert to bitmaps all your objects with transparent areas before exporting as PDF/x.

See the second attach - the first object (above) is your original, the second (below) was converted to bitmap (True color + Alpha @ 300dpi) before exporting )))

I hope, you got a sense )

Hi Scott.

The rasterised bounding area of the bowl image which overlaps the rectangle is causing that section of orange vector border to also rasterise which is anti-aliased. At some zoom levels it looks misaligned, but if you look closely, it's just antialiasing.

In my tests this also occurs in Xtreme version 3.2
My quick work-around is to create a bitmap copy of the final work at the resolution you require for print.


EDIT: Ooops - I see Alex & I cross posted a bit :)

No prob, Steve -- you have better English :D

It is the old Adobe zoom problem when I exported the drawing and viewed it in Acro I got the same bottom line shift as you got. When you zoom in on one of the rectangles the shift goes away. What I would suggest that you do, as there is no need to create a bitmap copy, is to go into the custom settings and choose either PDF/x-3 2002 or2003 as this handles transparencies much better. It also relates better to AI and Acro better maintaining groups, masks ect. Also have a read of the help files in this area it gives a much fuller explanation than I have done but basically it does what Steve did by rasterising the area in question but automatically and you can set the dpi to what you want. As you can see in the screen shots there is no real difference

Thank you both so much. Question - when you say convert the whole group to a bitmap with True color+alpha, I think you mean export the group as a PNG then reimport, yes? I know about the "creat bimap copy" withing Xara, but that just makes a bitmap - no options for transparancy, etc.

Thanks, Scott

Actually, you can select the group, then click Arrange | Create Bitmap Copy. AFAIK, these bitmap copies are natively PNG. The dialog that comes up is essentially identical to the export dialog, so you can set the color depth and resolution for the copy. Then place the copy as needed.

I would put the bitmap copy on a separate layer once you have it, then hide the layer(s) containing the original elements. That way you always have them to go back to for further tweaking or future editing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by scottmcll

I know about the "creat bimap copy" withing Xara, but that just makes a bitmap - no options for transparancy, etc.

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A PNG is a Bitmap (gif, tiff, png, jpg & bmp are all raster type bitmaps)
As amoore said, the dialogue for 'Create Bitmap Copy' is the same used for the export box and gives you the same options for dpi and transparency.