Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
Firstly, thanks for the changes to text input. It does now seem to be possible to type Japanese and most dead-keys into the text tool. (Maybe this was fixed before, in 3.2, but I never got around to upgrading to that version...?)
However Xtreme seems to camp on a few alt-gr combinations to provide its own shortcuts, in particular:
alt-gr+c: ©
alt-gr+r: ®
alt-gr+t: ™
alt-gr+b: •
alt-gr+w: import from web
(generally, not just in text tool)
I'm using a keyboard layout that likes to use those combos for extended dead-keys, so I'd really rather it didn't do that. It's not really Xara's job to be fiddling with the keyboard layout, and putting a command short-cut on alt-gr seems a bit wacky, I'm wondering if 'import from web' is even supposed to be there!
Can this be configured off, or maybe changed in a future version?
cheers,
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
if you have pro4 you can use customise key short cuts to clear import from the web from ctr-alt+w
the others don't appear in the list so I don't think it will work with these
maybe they should be there?
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
I'm not sure those combo's can be reconfigured in Xtremes shortcut key editor or the registry, at least I couldn't find them. They are likely internal.
I'm accustomed to using the Alt codes, I'm sure you know them.
Here's a list that I have handy for when I need them.
Others might find them useful also?
ALT Codes (alt+number)
(listed in no particular order)
-----------------------------
» 0187
• 0149
© 0169
® 0174
™ 0153
¥ 0165
¢ 0162
° 0176
€ 0128
£ 156
► 16
◄ 17
→ 26
← 27
↑ 24
↓ 25
♫ 14
♪ 13
☺1
☻2
◙ 10
☼ 15
■ 254
¼ 0188
½ 0189
¾ 0190
---------------------------------
There are many more of course, but I have little need for them.
Even the above list are used rarely with the exception of a few.
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
indeed
import from web is ok - because it is in the short cut utility list - confirmed that can be de-assigned
the others I tried reassigning - but it dosn't appear to work - likely internal as you say - which is a pity
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
Here's a list I made years ago, some of Steve's are duplicated, but there
may be others you'll find useful.
Saludos,
Bob.
€ = ALT + 0128
£ = ALT + 0163
© = ALT + 0169
® = ALT + 0174
¼ = ALT + 0188
½ = ALT + 0189
¾ = ALT + 0190
á = ALT + 0225
é = ALT + 0233
í = ALT + 0237
ó = ALT + 0243
ú = ALT + 0250
Á = ALT + 0193
É = ALT + 0201
Í = ALT + 0205
Ó = ALT + 0211
Ú = ALT + 0218
ä = ALT + 0228
ë = ALT + 0235
ï = ALT + 0239
ö = ALT + 0246
ü = ALT + 0252
æ = ALT + 0230
Æ = ALT + 0198
ê = ALT + 0234
ô = ALT + 0244
û = ALT + 0251
÷ = ALT + 0247
« = ALT + 0171
» = ALT + 0187
ß = ALT + 0223
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
Bear in mind that different countries use different alt codes - I noticed that £ - 156 is shown on Bob's (iamtheblues) keyboard as 0163. Both are valid
If you use a 3 number code, you are using the OEM code page and with a leading 0 to give a 4 number code, you are using the ANSI code page. Both change dependent upon location and hardware.
If you need alt codes there is a good reference at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt_codes
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
an alternative alt key if you will
cant remember what it was originally
on my keyboard it is only present as 'alt gr'
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BobInce
alt-gr+c: ©
alt-gr+r: ®
alt-gr+t: ™
alt-gr+b: •
alt-gr+w: import from web
(generally, not just in text tool)
On my US keyboard, those shortcuts are ctl-alt, rather than alt-gr. The first three (C, R and T), at any rate, are long-time conventions in US DTP and wordprocessing. Don't know if they're considered "Windows" standards at this point, but it's possible. They're built into MS Word 2003, for example.
Losing those conventions would likely result in a lot of noise from users who're accustomed to them. I wonder if it's possible in the shortcut utility to distinguish between your gr key, since you say it's an alternative alt, and the ctl key. Or perhaps those shortcuts could be made accessible in the utility so you could change them.
Ctl-alt B is rather useful in the way Xtreme does text formatting, so I would hate to see that one "undefined".
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
got a feeling that the modern keyboards do not have gr anymore as such - and that my uk board is just using different label for what is in effect a combined alt-crtl key - but I could be wrong
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
Quote:
On my US keyboard, those shortcuts are ctl-alt, rather than alt-gr
It's effectively the same, Windows maps ctrl-alt to alt-gr, as original AT keyboards didn't have an alt-gr key.
Quote:
Don't know if they're considered "Windows" standards at this point, but it's possible
Well not really, Windows standards are those keys supported by Windows. Word does a thousand other configurable little funny shortcuts and autoreplaces not supported by any other app. (Not all of them very clever, natch, but at least they're easily disabled.)
The US International keyboard layout does give © and ® on alt-gr+c/r, but not the other shortcuts (eg. ™ overrides þ). One or more of these keys also clashes with several standard Eastern European keyboards.
Quote:
Losing those conventions would likely result in a lot of noise from users who're accustomed to them.
Well an option would be best of course, but Ctrl-Alt shortcuts are an acknowledged Wrong Thing (see eg. http://blogs.msdn.com/oldnewthing/ar...29/101121.aspx ). There should be plenty of alternative key combinations available.
Re: Xtreme re-using alt-gr combinations
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BobInce
Well not really, Windows standards are those keys supported by Windows. Word does a thousand other configurable little funny shortcuts and autoreplaces not supported by any other app.
Agreed, and it's far from my favorite app. I use it only when forced. However, the three shortcuts I cited above work by default in other non-Microsoft apps that I do use voluntarily and on a regular basis. Some of them have been around for a number of years. Those hotkeys aren't new.
Like it or not, at least in the US, Word is commonly used, and many of its users not only assume that it's built into the operating system, but that it's the only wordprocessor or DTP app in existence. There are also many who insist that any app that includes text processing work the same way Word does. I'm not saying they're right. But they are legion.
Acknowledged. However, while it's understandable that Ctl-Alts could be left undefined by default, I don't want to see them prevented in the way that some apps are now prohibiting two-letter alt combinations. Just as you have a stumbling block with your dead key assignments, I have a stumbling block when an app refuses to support Alt FA, a shortcut I've been using constantly for years and which works quite well in nearly every other app I work with. Next to Ctl S, it's by far the most frequent shortcut I use. Plus, I'm mnemonically oriented. In most instances, I remember letter combinations far better than I remember combinations of control and function keys. (It would be such a relief if I could assign Ctl GS for "Group as Shape" and Ctl GM for "Group as Movie" in SWiSHmax. Keeping track of Shift G and Ctl Shift G is a struggle.)
