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I've found a program called GIMP (Gnu Image Manipulation Program) that is by far and a way closest to Photoshop. And it's free. IMO, it tops Photo-Paint, PaintShop Pro, and PhotoImpact for image manipulation (retouching).
http://www2.arnes.si/~sopjsimo/gimp/
You want to download the run-time and the program itself, the top two items on the list. The Mac is not supported but if you scrounge this site, UNIX is also supported.
My Best,
Gare
I've found a program called GIMP (Gnu Image Manipulation Program) that is by far and a way closest to Photoshop. And it's free. IMO, it tops Photo-Paint, PaintShop Pro, and PhotoImpact for image manipulation (retouching).
http://www2.arnes.si/~sopjsimo/gimp/
You want to download the run-time and the program itself, the top two items on the list. The Mac is not supported but if you scrounge this site, UNIX is also supported.
My Best,
Gare
uh, tops all those apps you say?
haha, come on Gary... there are alot of apps out there I would choose for image manipulation, but I seriously doubt that GIMP is one of them... it is buggy, least ways on my system, and furthermore IMHO comes nowhere close to having near the features as several of those apps you have mentioned...
Gidget...
In context, you misquoted me. I said it tops Photo-Paint for *image retouching*, and I mean it. Photo-paint might have a robust feature set, but I'll betcha many people will go for the tight "feel" of Gimp for image editing tasks. Image retouching, okay?
First of all we cannot forget that it is free, and second, the latest version is running on my system without bugs (although I'm using XP and you said you're running Windows 3.1, right? http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/wink.gif
I was not referring to, for example, Photo-Paint's bloated feature set, that has fifteen thousand filters of which you'd use them once or twice. I'm talking straight image editing---retouching, and not creating 3D stars or stuff. You need core tools...paint tools, masking tools, path creation tools, cloning tools, and so on. Not everyone needs "extended" features, such as 3D Transform, CMYK preview, and the like.
Photoshop is a gold standard, but I believe that Gimp should take the Bronze metal for a look and feel that's very close to PS (so you can learn it and then buy up) and a footprint of less than 10MB.
I'm sorry if I sound opinionated, but we're all dissing stuff far too frequently on this forum to the point where I feel reluctant to post new (at least new to me) downloaded with which people can play, learn, and ultimately expand their talents. Counter-opinions are fine, naturally, but Gidget, you gotta actually play with the new version to see for yourself that it has bugs. I found none so far.
My Best,
Gare
carry on my XP freind... please demonstrate some of why this app rocks in this area... I am all eyes http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
and, since it is you who have "dissed" PI along with several others here in your post through claiming better than status for Gimp, then I would be very interested in just how this app is more powerfull in any area than is PI... specifically PI there Gare... You have to download the latest version first and really understand it, become friendly with it, before you can suggest such IMHO... http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/tongue.gif
I think I'm reading Linux between your lines Gary ;-}
Gimp is really a great app, on Linux it uses much less resource than on Win (any version).
However, on my win machine I'm still using Corel PhotoPaint 7 (LOL if you want), but for image editing, scaling, cropping, masks and the 1000+ PS plug-ins I've installed that's good enough. At least it's small, stable and fast.
BTW, there is an alternative: PhotoLine 32 -> http://www.pl32.com which is available for Win and Mac. Small, fast, beautiful, almost a clone of PS. A good deal for around US$ 100 I think. They used to have a minor bug - the algorithms for downscaling a pic, but I guess it's solved now.
I think I would prefer the GTK 2.21, but I have to check the compatibility with the Gimp for Windows.
jens g.r. benthien
designer
http://www.sacalobra.de
----------//--
If you don't know how to dream you'll never be a designer.
----------//--
I agree with Gidget, it's buggy http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/wink.gif
A qoute from their web site about their windows version:
"The program(s) might crash unexpectedly or behave otherwise strangely
They even admit it themselves http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Btw, what has Gimp to do with 3D graphics? http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/confused.gif
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Btw, what has Gimp to do with 3D graphics? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
01. Postproduction / Postprocessing
02. Textures
03. Bump maps
04. Good to know there's somethin'
05. To insert your sig into final renderings
06. To keep you busy
07. To pull you away from 3D to realize there is something else ;-}
08. To give you a break
09. To return to a pixel and forget the voxels for a short time
10. I don't know
Enough?;-}
jens g.r. benthien
designer
http://www.sacalobra.de
----------//--
If you don't know how to dream you'll never be a designer.
----------//--
I tried Gimp some time ago, an earlier version I guess. It was just about the ugliest-looking app I had EVER seen, and was promptly deleted! I don't care about "many features" if the thing is unbearable to look at.
Ah, the joys of Adobe products - superior down to the very smallest detail, also looks-wise. True designers and artists just looooooove "good looks" - it's what makes our hearts pump!
K
www.klausnordby.com/xara (big how-to article)
www.xaraxone.com/FeaturedArt/kn/ (I was the first-ever featured artist in the Xone)
www.graphics.com (columnist, "The I of The Perceiver")
Okay, I'm guilty of dissing Photo-Impact, but Gidgit, I've used Photo-Impact, as well as the latest version of Gimp. I make it a point to download demos to see where Photoshop might be ahead or behind, and I further confess that I started image editing with Aldus PhotoStyler, and then Photoshop when it became available in Windows flavor, so the old truth holds with me, too: you tend to stick with the app you started with (mostly to save a new learning curve).
Gimp struck me a truly useful app, one that requires a shorter learning curve than other image editors. To me, and this is just my oipinion and I've written several chapters in other people's books in the past, Photo-Paint for example, has a difficult interface to learn; it does not make the layout "sense" oif other apps.
Here's an example of ponying up concerning my statement about Gimp. Below are two pictures I melded to stop my nephew from ruining the first picture. I did this in Gimp, I have not read the documentation,m and it took about 15 minutes, 5 of them poking around for features.
Why did I just know that you'd contribute to this thread, Klaus? http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Your comments about the look of an interface are valid to a certain extent, but hey, Maya, and particluarly SoftImage are butt-ugly, and somehow "true artists" seem to plod along begrudgingly and win academy awards using them.
Glad to see you back after four months.
My Best,
Gare
The primary problem with DA GIMP is that most of the common actions are buried deep in a twitchy menu system. Those menus would make anyone go batty.
Besides being ugly and buggy, DA GIMP just plain sucks because it is slow and a pain to use. Not to mention it crashes a lot.
On a scale of 1-10 Xara X is a 10 for sheer usability, speed and great output. DA GIMP may get a 2 if you can stand to use it long enough to get any output. Otherwise it gets a 1/2.
They sure named it right: DA GIMP hobbles along while all the good apps walk or run.
http://talkgraphics.infopop.net/1/Op...&ul=1101906325
Why, I’m afraid I can’t explain myself, sir, because I’m not myself, you know...
- Lewis Carroll
Dale...
After I qualified my opinion, I took the time to validate my opinions by actually creating and posting some image editing in Gimp, and actually wrote a couple of private eMails to folks in apology for being "hard" and "opinionated", you get right in here and tell everyone that Da Gimp "sucks".
Okay, fine.
I haven't the faintest idea what this forum wants anymore. We debate things instead of discussing them, we post images but I don't see people taking an equal amnount of time to post tutorials, and I feel that a lot of times posts are made for the sheer pleasure of self-recognition, mostly couched in negative material. You know, Ivan resigned from the XARA forum because of the negativity and in-fighting? I think he's a gem and am sorry to see someone go that way. It's mostly an issue of "attitude" here--the PSG is a very positive forum and I don't see why we can't be here, too.
I'd like to ask everyone if we could possibly think twice and post once? Some positive energy in this forum would build upon itself, you know?
My Best,
Gare
Gary David Bouton
Gary@GaryDavidBouton.com
Free education! The Writings Web site
and the updated GaryWorld Gallery is pretty okay, too.
Hey, Klaus, did you finally buy a mac or so? Just wondering...the way you write about Adobe's "superiority", the construction your of phrases, your arguments...this is really mac talk (I won't write Apple talk because that at least is a kind of communication...). Or do you suffer from a new fit of ego constipation?
I, for one, cannot paint with Talens oil colours. They contain too much oil, and a large quantity of the pigments are replaced by filling agents. I prefer Blockx and Oudt Hollands.
Yet never in my life I've been involved in something as silly as a discussion on which brand of oil paints would be the best. I know a French painter, François Schlesser ( http://imagic21eme.free.fr ), who uses Talens. Looking at his work is sufficient to make all the bigmouths shut up.
What I want to say is that it is high time to become a bit civilised, and stop spitting out opinions that add nothing whatsoever to the conversation on the topic.
When someone has really worked with any app untill he got it in his fingers, and the work of this specialist shows clearly that his work is not up to the stardards set by another specialist using another app, then we may conclude that app a has not the same quality of app b. When Gary posts this image, no one can tell whether it is done in PS, PP, PSP, the Gimp or any other app. All the rest is a waste of time.
Shorthly I will install Linux on a puter. And I am shure that the Gimp will be the first Linux app I'll open. I have seen many fascinating things done with it. And I don't have to invest my money as I can download the latest version of most known Linux distributions from the Internet.
I don't post often anymore at TG. The atmosphere lacks enthusiasm and some kind of friendliness I need to function well. Pity. Sorry to read that Ivan left...
I remember using an early version of GIMP at some point. I think it's kinda cool, for a free app. It's amazing how many free apps there are out there that have quite a few features under their belt. Then you take programs like Photo-Paint and Photoshop that have teams of programmers associated with them, and you wonder what the $(*&$ they spend all their time DOING!
Though I've been a long time Corel (Photo-Paint) fan, I'm finding myself using Photoshop more for certain tasks. I switch between the two often, and almost interchangably. It frustrates me to no end that one single program can't 'get it all right.'
But then... I could just be picky...
Thanks for posting the link Gary! It's always good to keep an eye on all that's out there...
I'd like to apologize for the initial comment I made about Gimp esseentially blowing away Photo-Impact, PSP, and Photo-Paint. I can and have used all these programs to get a feel for their feature set, and truth be known, PaintShop Pro has some pretty neat filters.
The reason I even brought up Gimp was because a friend of mine out in Hollywood told me that enterprises...production houses...are using Gimp because site licenses for 400 seats for Photoshop would kill a budget. My bud also tells me to watch Photoshop 8 closely, to see if we don't get an integrated workflow between video editing and image editing. Seems that a "secret" feature of the Unix version of Gimp (I think) enables you to cut, paste, and edit as a seamless workflow, so if for example, you needed to get rid of a traffic sign in a video, you'd clone it out using Gimp, instead of After Effects.
I'm sorry this thread got so empassioned, and I for one will zip it in the future if someone else wants to diss a post of mine. And by dissing, I mean a poorly-qualified opinion, such as, "Ew, it's ugly, it doesn't match the color of my scarf", or, "Brand X is better. It just is."
My Best,
Gare
Haha, boyo, how to respond to this...
um... let's see... it's how many votes for said app vs how many against... seems kinda democratic to me... as for the attitude... well, I would venture to say that it is much more tame in here than in the House of Commons http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif ( another democratic type of place hehe )
There is a right way to compare apps, and then there is simply claiming... sure you put up a pic... but... no comparisons were made illustrating results from two or more apps, both for showing the nice results vs the nastier http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif, or demonstrating how said app carries you through the workflow.... in other words, what truly makes this app worthy of such claims... which in them selves thus prompted the debates, as in apposed to further discussing the merits of the app, which as stated, were not provided...
as for the forum comparison... or the retirement of a member or what have ya... well, it's a big free world out there eh... as long as everyone is happy in what they do...
as for posting works for the personal satisfaction... well... don't get me going on this one... what the bejumping jimminies do you think many are here for? To show off talents, to share tips and tricks, to shoot the breaze... whatever the days brings about... http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
I am going to stop right here http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Gidget...
This has become a hopelessly entangled morass of ill-will and antagonism. I'm sorry for my contribution to this negativity.
I'm not going to post anything more on this thread, except that everyone is entitled to their opinions, and Gimp is a free image editor that doesn't take too long to download.
Peace,
Gare
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>This has become a hopelessly entangled morass of ill-will and antagonism. I'm sorry for my contribution to this negativity <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Amen, Gary, wow.
I usually lurk here because it used to be a vital, active group that I enjoyed being a part of. Gary pops in here (and for those who may not know, Gary was and is a very talented, impassioned, caring man with alot to offer this group) to show an interesting app he found (I've used the Gimp and it's non-modal windows are not my cup of tea) and he gets this? Maybe his claims were a bit premature, but this man has written books on Photoshop. How many others can stand up and say that? IOW, he knows his image editing apps. Cut him a little slack, guys, let's be civil, huh?
Gary, nice example (your nephew) of the power of the Gimp. I couldn't have pulled it off, but that's a pretty seamless composite.
Gidgit, I'm at a loss for words. You're usually very upbeat and cheerful in your words; in this thread you've spit a bit of venom at an undeserving target.
Brett
I tried the Gimp on another computer (may have been win 98 or ME or XP .,..cant recall). I didn't use it long as there were too many windows (for my liking), too many pop-up things, and my wacom pen wasn't working. It was said on the site ( at that time) that the windows version is generally not kept up to date as much as the other versions of it. All I can say is if someone likes it , that's great but I personally didn't like it much.
Part of my discomfort with the Gimp (at least my memory of the version I tried) was that it didn't have an interface I was happy with. I like a certain interface which PhotoImpact has had for years. Corel also has this (context sensitive settings bar depending on tool currently picked) as does XaraX. More programs are getting this including Photoshop's last version or two and even the new Painter8 will have it's current settings bar improved to be more like this style. Macromedias Mireworks MX also has this.
I'm sure it can do a lot and it's free so if someone uses it , that's great.
If there's a new windows version, I might check it out as I'm alsways trying out as many app demos as I can http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/smile.gif
I got carried away. Those were my opinions of the GIMP, based on my frustrations trying it out. OK, I was too negative without being very constructive. Oops!
Its free, so give it a try if you like! If you like doing most actions by selecting menu items you'll love it! http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/wink.gif
Constructive criticism - The Gimp would be hugely more attractive without that crazy menu system. According to sources I have read, the programmer of the Gimp refuses to change the interface to one that is more user-friendly. I would love to see the interface improved and would try it again if that happened.
I don't believe that TG is any more negative than it used to be. I feel that the most positive aspect of TG is in its members willingness to help others, which has not changed at all IMO. Though a few posts here and there ARE negative, I believe that some members tend to take posts personally or negatively when those posts were not intended that way.
A good example, Gidgit's posts on this thread. What venom? What negativity? I don't see any of that in Gidgits's posts.
My two cents.
I am out of this thread too. We don't need flamewars or hard feelings over an app! More power to those who use Gimp! http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
http://talkgraphics.infopop.net/1/Op...&ul=1101906325
Why, I’m afraid I can’t explain myself, sir, because I’m not myself, you know...
- Lewis Carroll
haha, this has been some real excitement for sure... http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/wink.gif http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/wink.gif
yes, no venom in these bones... http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif
Brett... smile http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/smile.gif
Gary... you too http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/smile.gif
everybody else... get back to creat'n eh... http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/smile.gif
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dale Landry:
A good example, Gidgit's posts on this thread. What venom? What negativity? I don't see any of that in Gidgits's posts.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I totally agree Dale. I don't notice any venom or negativity.