Placeholders - is there a limit to html code/text?

Hi

I have a website written many years ago in basic HTML. Though I don't want to replace the majority of pages (it would take too long), the introductory pages could be made much more attractive if I replaced them with pages produced using Xara Designer Pro.

The stumbling block appears to be a lengthy menu contained in a vertical scrolling box. http://www.waterwaysongs.info/SongMenu.htm

I have tried creating a placeholder on a Xara page and copying the <div> .... </div> section into it. Copying and pasting the appropriate html text into the html placeholder always fails with only the first part getting pasted in place. The placeholder works with a small portion of the menu items but not with the full list.

I have a fully functioning website produced using Xara where I have used this method. https://www.pyramidfolk.info/

My question is - Is there a limit to the number of characters that can be accommodated within a placeholder?

If so, has anyone any suggestions for an alternative menu which links to over 300 different web pages?

Regards
Ian

Ian, I have just checked and the limit appears to be just over 25kB.

What you have is not a menu but an HTML Table of links, which makes a difference.
You are trying to leverage in some 83kB of data.

To achieve the same thing, I would create a very long Xara page with all 300+ links and bookmark the first song for each alphabetic letter (A-Z) entry.

On the Alphabetical Song Menu page, I would create an IFRAME Placeholder with a src (I used songlist.htm) to the new page.
This page would have the A to Z bar set to jump to each Anchor (Xara use the Names for this).
Each link also needs a Target (Xara uses Open link for this), where you type in the IFRAME name (here, songs).

A quick demo file:
:pointAttachment 126803.

I would split the long list into 26 separate pages but that is a personal preference.

Acorn

Hi Acorn

Thank you very much for taking the time to produce the demo file and responding so promptly. Your observations and suggestions have both explained the problem and provided me with a path forward. Though it will take some time I will be following through on your suggestion. I had no knowledge of IFRAMEs or if I did I've forgotten all about them so I am very happy to have been pointed in the right direction.

Many, many thanks.
Ian

Hi

Nearly a year after the last post I've returned to this to find more problems. Acorn's solution works fine but when I try something similar the selected text doesn't appear in the iframe, but replaces the selection (index) page.

I've attached the xar file which shows the problem, I hope. The only significant(?) difference I've made to Acorn's solution is to use a home-made navigation bar to select the text anchors.

I hope this makes sense.

Hopefully there's a simple solution which someone out there can see.

Stay safe,
Ian

Ian, I will describe how to fix your immediate problem.

Open your NavBar.
Double-click on an item in the URL column - the Link dialog will open.
Click into the Open link in box.
Replace the highlighted text with songs typed or copied across.
Click OK.
Repeat for all song anchors.
Click OK to save the NavBar.

Add more SongList pages, add more Anchors...

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I would open the NabBar, Ungroup to edit graphics and forget about it.
You don't need a NavBar for an A-Z.

I would include a 0-9 entry.

For each anchor, I might prepend a Link to the last Anchor and append a link to the next Anchor.
This allows for a quicker navigation.

I would create smaller SongList pages and use sub-anchors if you have to split a group.
Your anchors will always find the right page.

Acorn

This is he bit you missed:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Acorn

Each link also needs a Target (Xara uses Open link for this), where you type in the IFRAME name (here, songs).

A quick demo file:
:pointAttachment 126803.
I would split the long list into 26 separate pages but that is a personal preference.
Acorn

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Thanks Acorn

I had downloaded your demo and it worked fine. It was only my attempt to modify it that caused problems.

I rather like your suggestions for links to previous and next anchors and will be modifying my work accordingly. It may take some time before the new menu appears on the net as there are rather a large number of links to be made but I'm excited to be making some progress (I hope). I just about recollect the excitement of encountering Artworks on the Archimedes (there's still a couple in the loft) and have generally been very happy using Computer Concepts/Xara products. I continue to use Xara Designer Pro (v18) and am a little bemused by Pro+ and the way Magix and Xara keep changing things, but then again I am becoming ancient!

Small problems can seem like mountains sometimes, so it is immensely valuable to have help such as yours, Acorn. Thanks again.

Ian

I read this with interest as, like Ian, I use placeholders infrequently and often forget steps taken between uses. Acorn, can you comment on the relationship between placeholder size, external data page size, and the size specified in the html code? I've fixed my errors, but only by messing around, rather than following a formula.

Many thanks!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Windjamer

I read this with interest as, like Ian, I use placeholders infrequently and often forget steps taken between uses. Acorn, can you comment on the relationship between placeholder size, external data page size, and the size specified in the html code? I've fixed my errors, but only by messing around, rather than following a formula.
Many thanks!

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Windjamer, I usually set up the code in a placeholder to ensure it tracks the size of the Xara box sizes (w x h).
So my code could be <iframe name="fred" src="windjamer.com" width=100% hight=100%>Anything here as the IFRAME ignores it unless the browser is very old!</iframe>
The name fred is now a target so you can use a link elsewhere to google.com and if your add fred to the Open link in box, the click will open Google in the IFRAME.

If the targeted page is adaptive you get a view dependent on the Placeholder width (w).
If the page is longer than the Placeholder height (h), you get a vertical scrollbar.

That's about it.

You can use Javascript or anchors to open the page down from the top and set the scrollbars not to show and without borders the result looks as if it has always been part of the page.

Acorn

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Acorn

Windjamer, I usually set up the code in a placeholder to ensure it tracks the size of the Xara box sizes (w x h).
So my code could be <iframe name="fred" src="windjamer.com" width=100% hight=100%>Anything here as the IFRAME ignores it unless the browser is very old!</iframe>
The name fred is now a target so you can use a link elsewhere to google.com and if your add fred to the Open link in box, the click will open Google in the IFRAME.

If the targeted page is adaptive you get a view dependent on the Placeholder width (w).
If the page is longer than the Placeholder height (h), you get a vertical scrollbar.

That's about it.

You can use Javascript or anchors to open the page down from the top and set the scrollbars not to show and without borders the result looks as if it has always been part of the page.

Acorn

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Thanks, Acorn; much appreciated!

Hello again

Another question, I'm afraid, which may be related to Windjamer's query. In my latest attempt to modify Acorn's xar demo I end up with a horizontal scrollbar on the scrollbox which I don't want. And when the up or down arrows (which are linked to the next anchor) the whole menu page shifts to the left within the scroll box and becomes partially invisible. Is there a mismatch of placeholder dimensions and menu page width? I've tried specifying width as an absolute value in the widget and as 100%.

File attached which shows problem.

Apologies if I'm missing something obvious.

Ian

Quote:

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Originally Posted by IanB

Hello again
Another question, I'm afraid, which may be related to Windjamer's query. In my latest attempt to modify Acorn's xar demo I end up with a horizontal scrollbar on the scrollbox which I don't want. And when the up or down arrows (which are linked to the next anchor) the whole menu page shifts to the left within the scroll box and becomes partially invisible. Is there a mismatch of placeholder dimensions and menu page width? I've tried specifying width as an absolute value in the widget and as 100%.
File attached which shows problem.
Apologies if I'm missing something obvious.
Ian

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Iain, the problem is simply put, yes, you cannot have a 960px wide page fitting into an 810px wide Placeholder without code to hide the x-scroll.

Either make the Placeholder as wide as songs pages' width
OR
Reduce the width of the songs pages.

For the jumping left, the page is simply moving to the position of the Anchor.
Change the Anchors to be on the upward arrows.

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Seriously though, by the time you add the links and the music/video the filesize of the songs page you have will kill your website for a viewer: it will take a long time to download.
Split the songs across pages.

Acorn

Hi Acorn,

An obvious solution which completely escaped me - I was altering the size of the frame on the songs page rather than the page itself.

I was unsure of the advantage of splitting the songs into separate pages and now you've pointed out the loading time implication I can see why it will be necessary. There won't be any video on this menu but I can see that the song list is very long. I will be splitting it into separate pages next.

Though I've produced a few websites starting from scratch with Xara, this 'Songs of the Inland Waterways' site was started perhaps 15 years ago and written in very basic HTML with the help of Dreamweaver 8. Now some pages feature videos, Dreamweaver keeps pointing out incompatibilities with HTML Version 1 so, rather than go through the pain of attempting to learn HTML 5 or whatever is the modern language I should be using (and failing) I thought I'd let Xara Designer Pro (v18) take the strain. I have successfully produced a small section of website which I have integrated with the older HTML pages and that was encouraging. Re-writing the menu became the next obvious step and, with Acorn's help I can now see the light at the end of the tunnel.

Thanks again. I find this Talk Graphics site to be invaluable when I hit brick walls.

Stay safe,
Ian

Hi

Thanks to Acorn I have produced a version of my lengthy menu which appears to work.

http://www.waterwaysongs.info/songmenu.htm

I'm not sure if that is the result Acorn envisaged but it seems OK and similar to the ancient HTML original.

Suggestions for improvement would be welcome.

Ian

Quote:

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Originally Posted by IanB

Hi
Thanks to Acorn I have produced a version of my lengthy menu which appears to work.
http://www.waterwaysongs.info/songmenu.htm
I'm not sure if that is the result Acorn envisaged but it seems OK and similar to the ancient HTML original.
Suggestions for improvement would be welcome.
Ian

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Ian, far slicker!

I like the 0-9 and the mainly shorter lists.

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I would have added hover text to all the 0-9, A-Z and up/downs.

I would have used white for the Pasteboard.
I would have mad the Songs page longer and its Placeholder.
These are my preferences and might change the quikiness of the site.

Acorn

Acorn

I've already changed the Pasteboard. It was coloured while I adjusted page sizes. I'll implement your other suggestions shortly.

Thanks again for helping me through a brick-wall.

Ian