A new plea for User Interface options other than black

I won't go through what I'm sure is a well worn litany of reasons for a workspace UI that is other than black. Designers work in many different ways, some even preferring a clean (all tools hidden) workspace. And, some are either partially or fully color blind. In my case, I've lost most of the vision in my left eye, and what's left is quite unfocused. So, grey-ish/white lettering against black, especially in a small point size, is extremely difficult to read. I need a higher contrast environment, both for tool icons and text, in order to clearly see what I'm doing.

What has been the past feedback from the Devs on optional UI color background/combination choices? Of all the many requests that must filter across their digital desks, UI options must surely rank among the easiest to implement.


RistonRants "but often by hunt and peck" in NWArkansas

Try this press ALT,CTRL,Shift,S all at once.

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Originally Posted by Mike Bailey

Try this press ALT,CTRL,Shift,S all at once.

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But do note you will loose any customizations you have made when you switch to the gray interface.

White on black = maximum contrast.
At small point sizes, white on black will tend to look gray, because of anti-aliasing.

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Originally Posted by Mike Bailey

Try this press ALT,CTRL,Shift,S all at once.

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Thank you! Much better on these 58 year old eyes ...

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Originally Posted by Mike Bailey

Try this press ALT,CTRL,Shift,S all at once.

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Much more better!! However, I notice that the icons are smaller in the gray UI. But, I'm not recalling ever setting the icons to be larger in the dark UI. Mike, is this the customization you are addressing? And, if so, how do I set the larger icon format that shows in the dark UI?

Jack "only half blind" Riston

Click on the Window menu and select control bars, in the control bars window you will see "Use large buttons for" select an area or just select all.

Thanks again, much better! Tiny laptop screens are tough to see sometimes.

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Originally Posted by Mike Bailey

Click on the Window menu and select control bars, in the control bars window you will see "Use large buttons for" select an area or just select all.

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Fabulous. Sooooo much better. Thank!


RistonRants "but can see what he's ranting about" in NWArkansas

the grey UI is no longer officially supported by Xara - I mention this because use of it under certain conditions might cause the program rendering problems on the screen, so if this happens you might wish to revert back to check [ bearing in mind as stated above that every time you switch, all your UI customisations are reset]

I also have a strong preference for the light UI and am happy that I can still set up my custom bars etc. and use it. I have XDP11 so I hope this option still works in version 12 of Xara's product line.

This is how you can do it:

1. Customize your setup using the default dark interface. When you tick the relevant boxes in the Windows/Control bars dialog you can also have the large buttons.
2. Once you're done, do not use the ctrl-shft-alt-S combo but close the program and go to where your Xara program is installed. So in my case the path is: "C:\Program Files\Xara\Xara Designer Pro X11" (if you’re using the 32-bit version you have to go the “Program Files (x86)” directory).
3. Locate "xaradark_theme.xml." Make a copy of the file and save it in a different directory (this is only for safekeeping) and change the name of the file anyway you like (I added "OUT" to the file name -- again, this is only for safekeeping).
4. Now start up the program again. It will show the light-gray, default interface.

Good to know, handrawn. All the more reason why the Devs should consider an options tab to set most of the aspects of the UI, perhaps a number of color options for the surround, options for tool icons, etc. Even LibreOffice 5 has about 6 icon settings, although they offer no apparent ability to control the color of the overall UI. Serif has about 6 choices of overall UI colors in earlier editions of WebPlus, but dark/black was never one of them. In the Affinity series, however, they've gone for the dark/black UI, with no apparent ability to pick any light color. :banghead:

If I'm in a rather dimly lit room, then I can work with the dark UI without too much difficulty. In a brightly lit room, it's tough going. I will take your advice on board, and be on the watch for rendering issues.

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Originally Posted by Boy

I also have a strong preference for the light UI and am happy that I can still set up my custom bars etc. and use it. I have XDP11 so I hope this option still works in version 12 of Xara's product line.

This is how you can do it:

1. Customize your setup using the default dark interface. When you tick the relevant boxes in the Windows/Control bars dialog you can also have the large buttons.
2. Once you're done, do not use the ctrl-shft-alt-S combo but close the program and go to where your Xara program is installed. So in my case the path is: "C:\Program Files\Xara\Xara Designer Pro X11" (if you’re using the 32-bit version you have to go the “Program Files (x86)” directory).
3. Locate "xaradark_theme.xml." Make a copy of the file and save it in a different directory (this is only for safekeeping) and change the name of the file anyway you like (I added "OUT" to the file name -- again, this is only for safekeeping).
4. Now start up the program again. It will show the light-gray, default interface.

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Unfortunately, this does not work correctly
While the program indeed starts in the light colour, most of the icons disappear.
Maybe changing the values in the XML file would work ?.

Like many others I hate the black theme, I really cant see why Xara cant provide an option for colour choice.
Also I think that the icons need updating, they are really old looking now.

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Originally Posted by Boy

When you tick the relevant boxes in the Windows/Control bars dialog you can also have the large buttons.

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which update version of XDP11 are you using? - I dont see the large button option any more.... I don't see anything in the dialog except the list and the five buttons to the right...

Attachment 112683

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ok I tried the xml renaming fix and that seems to work

@Brugie - did you try closing the program and reopening it again - the missing toolbars/icons may just be a rendering issue the first time it opens without the xml - this is in fact what happened for me, it seemed fine after reopening

btw - yes, wonder what would happen if you edited the colour values in the dark theme xml... hummmm.... EDIT - not much, you can change the default pasteboard colour and a couple of other things, but to change the skin need to edit the style sheets I guess... no suprise there really...

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Originally Posted by handrawn

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ok I tried the xml renaming fix and that seems to work

@Brugie - did you try closing the program and reopening it again - the missing toolbars/icons may just be a rendering issue the first time it opens without the xml - this is in fact what happened for me, it seemed fine after reopening

btw - yes, wonder what would happen if you edited the colour values in the dark theme xml... hummmm.... EDIT - not much, you can change the default pasteboard colour and a couple of other things, but to change the skin need to edit the style sheets I guess... no suprise there really...

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Not all the interface colors are in the xml file. It's something that I have askedfor before.

Hi Mike - yes I just edited my post as you were posting... thanks :)

Yep--don't ya love cross-posting...

It would seem to me that the easiest means to accommodate people's desire for altering the UI color would have been to stuff all the color variables into the XML file. The only give a heck would be the icon format used in Xara products. I assume some colors/tones would work better than others would. But it would still give a degree of customization without seemingly being too much effort on Xara's part until such time they handle the issue properly.

That or make the light/dark UI actually supported and switchable without user hassle.

who said 'magix corporate branding'? nope not me, I never said that...

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Originally Posted by handrawn

which update version of XDP11 are you using? - I dont see the large button option any more.... I don't see anything in the dialog except the list and the five buttons to the right...

Attachment 112683

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Xara Designer Pro X 11.2.5.42127.
Concerning the large-button options, these show when the UI is light gray.

Attachment 112684

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Originally Posted by Brugie

Unfortunately, this does not work correctly
While the program indeed starts in the light colour, most of the icons disappear.

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Sorry to hear that. What version are you using? Do the icons on the Button Palate disappear or also the icons on the toolbars?

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Originally Posted by Boy

Xara Designer Pro X 11.2.5.42127.
Concerning the large-button options, these show when the UI is light gray.

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sure do :)

the way your post reads though, [to me], is that what is in action 1 should all be done before you switch UI in action 2 onwards

thanks for the clarification...

You're right, I could have been clearer.

no problem... never my strong point, clarity; claret maybe :D

Well, that clarifies the situation, doesn't it? :)

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Originally Posted by Boy

Sorry to hear that. What version are you using? Do the icons on the Button Palate disappear or also the icons on the toolbars?

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As you can see from the screenshot, its really messed up.
It opens with all the icons present, but as soon as you move the curser, they all start disappearing.

Version Pro X 11.2.5.42127 DL x64 Dec 9 2015

Attachment 112687

Gee, that looks awful! Did you set up your toolbars when still in the dark UI and then rename/remove the xaradark_theme.xml file?

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Originally Posted by Brugie

It opens with all the icons present, but as soon as you move the curser, they all start disappearing.

Version Pro X 11.2.5.42127 DL x64 Dec 9 2015

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seems like its the toolbars that are adrift - they are defined in windows registry - have you rebooted the computer? [always worth a try...]

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Originally Posted by Brugie

As you can see from the screenshot, its really messed up.
It opens with all the icons present, but as soon as you move the curser, they all start disappearing.

Version Pro X 11.2.5.42127 DL x64 Dec 9 2015

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That's interesting ... mine has begun starting up with NO icons, and they appear as I move the mouse over where they are supposed to be.

Buggy behavior! Why would changing the color to a scheme the designer included cause problems like this???

because it is a hack

removing the XML is not an officially supported procedure - and what then happens may also depend on your computer config

for example if you are not running your computer in admin mode [when you make the change] that may be one reason ....

same goes for shft+ctrl+alt+s to change the skin to light grey, not officially supported

so the word is not 'bug' which is a flaw - it is 'unpedictable/unexpected' which is a consequence of using something in a way it is not intended to be used ['at your own risk']

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Originally Posted by handrawn

because it is a hack

removing the XML is not an officially supported procedure - and what then happens may also depend on your computer config

for example if you are not running your computer in admin mode [when you make the change] that may be one reason ....

same goes for shft+ctrl+alt+s to change the skin to light grey, not officially supported

so the word is not 'bug' which is a flaw - it is 'unpedictable/unexpected' which is a consequence of using something in a way it is not intended to be used ['at your own risk']

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While you are surely sincere in your statement, are you saying that the folks while putting in the keystroke to make that change (yeah, programmer had to add the code for it to happen because that is a rather complicated keystroke combination to come about by chance) did not have the ability to allow for a secondary display of the user interface?

That would be just downright silly for a company to do. Even back in the DOS days, when we set up keystroke combinations (yeah, us old dinosaurs) they were deliberate - nothing accidental about them.

Changing the color of the UI should NOT affect the display of icons. Therefore ... buggy.

I can deal with the dark version for now if I must, but as I age in front of my displays, it is going to become more and more difficult --- especially on my laptop.

Oh, and while it has problems on XWD365 pro, it works FLAWLESSLY on XWD10 pro.

It is unsupported and has never received any "love" to make it viable. It isn't a bug per se, it has just either never been fully implemented and/or updated along with the application. That's why it is unsupported.

My guess is that it is a holdover from when the application had a lighter interface and someone just made a hook to it. But because it was never finished/updated, it is unsupported. It would have been better for Xara never to have left the hook in there or not communicated it was there in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Dijenga

are you saying that the folks while putting in the keystroke to make that change (yeah, programmer had to add the code for it to happen because that is a rather complicated keystroke combination to come about by chance) did not have the ability to allow for a secondary display of the user interface?

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yes that is what I am saying because the keystroke combination was only ever intended for the development programmers to use themselves [hence it being 'complicated' and therefore not likely to be done by accident]

this was made clear when the keystroke combination was first mentioned on this forum way back - maybe Mike is right, maybe it should not have been

it was also made clear that the switch could produce unpredictable results and that eventually it would probably stop working because it unsuported for the user - it is only meant for the programmers to test things out with

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That would be just downright silly for a company to do. Even back in the DOS days, when we set up keystroke combinations (yeah, us old dinosaurs) they were deliberate - nothing accidental about them.

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pushes CP/M manual back against door to keep it open, wistfully thinks back to the days of locoscript... and even further back to ICL 1900 and george 3... takes a deep breath and says: not silly; not accidental; see my reply above...

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Changing the color of the UI should NOT affect the display of icons. Therefore ... buggy.

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if it's done in a supported way then I agree, no; but when it it isn't you run the risk

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I can deal with the dark version for now if I must, but as I age in front of my displays, it is going to become more and more difficult --- especially on my laptop

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I have sympathy with this; I reckon magixara should give us a supported option, but i'm guessing it is not a priority for them amongst all the other clamour for new stuff

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Oh, and while it has problems on XWD365 pro, it works FLAWLESSLY on XWD10 pro.

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once again see my first reply in this post

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Originally Posted by mwenz

My guess is that it is a holdover from when the application had a lighter interface and someone just made a hook to it. But because it was never finished/updated, it is unsupported. It would have been better for Xara never to have left the hook in there or not communicated it was there in the first place.

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Not really just a hook. Up to and including XDP 11, new buttons for the light-gray interface were introduced to be able to access new functions. I don't know what the situation is with the version-12 software.

In programming, a hook is a place and usually an interface provided in packaged code that allows a programmer to insert customized programming

but I'm not saying that is necessarily what mike meant...

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Originally Posted by handrawn

yes that is what I am saying because the keystroke combination was only ever intended for the development programmers to use themselves [hence it being 'complicated' and therefore not likely to be done by accident]

this was made clear when the keystroke combination was first mentioned on this forum way back - maybe Mike is right, maybe it should not have been

it was also made clear that the switch could produce unpredictable results and that eventually it would probably stop working because it unsuported for the user - it is only meant for the programmers to test things out with


pushes CP/M manual back against door to keep it open, wistfully thinks back to the days of locoscript... and even further back to ICL 1900 and george 3... takes a deep breath and says: not silly; not accidental; see my reply above...


if it's done in a supported way then I agree, no; but when it it isn't you run the risk

I have sympathy with this; I reckon magixara should give us a supported option, but i'm guessing it is not a priority for them amongst all the other clamour for new stuff




once again see my first reply in this post

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Thanks. I guess I can live with it for now ... besides, getting ready to take a look at Graviton so I'll likely be away for a few days.