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I say this because of the trend where companies are trying to convince people that they do not need to own an actual program. I say people want to own a program and they do not want their data floating around on a server. People can try to defend that all they want but companies will find sales will go down.
Absolutely agree ...
I want to "own" my software not lease it.
Also, the people who want everyone to work in the cloud are also assuming that everyone has a nice fast reliable internet connection. I'm lucky to get a consistent 2.5 MB ... I NEVER want to work in the cloud anyway. My data is MY DATA.
Keith - you do not own the software - you own a licence to use it - the licence forbids modification to the program code which remains the propeerty of the company - if the software requires activation and the company no longer exists and activation is therefore not possible, end of story... so, if you are that concerned about 'cloud', and activation over the internet is 'cloud', you will not be using xara software after about ver 6/7... [I forget for sure when the internet activation came in]
[EDIT - lets emphasise this - the only difference between the '365' licence model and the previous xara licence model is that the previous licence is 'forvever' [subjrct to activation where applicable]; whereas the 365 model, whilst giving you this at the point at which you purchase/upgrade, also gives you an annual licence for improvements during the next 12 months subject to you not restoring your computer]
having got that out of the way; David what can I say except that I know people who love cloud software and use it all the time - just two of it's advantages are that you can work on lower spec portable devices, and the software is always up to date and fully compatible with the others that you work with - sure it is not going to be suitable for everyone, nor for every set of working conditions, and I appreciate the security aspect you and Keith mentioned.... but it is here, established and I don't think it is going away anytime soon
Xara are not [currently] suggesting the desktop vesion goes cloud - Xara Cloud is a different product to Designer pro you do not have to use it; I don't.
But I do use Office in the cloud, and Dropbox, and I would not want to be without them because working with others in different locations would take longer and be less efficient... in a nutshell, a lot more work...
Handrawn, The concept of the cloud is to take away more and more of what we 'own'. When we buy a piece of software when we possess it we 'own' it. The cloud makes our use of software dependent on logging into the cloud. It also requires the internet. I do not agree with Magix's making peoples pc's dependent upon the internet in order to use the software. That move was to pave the way for the cloud based software. I think your views are in the minority. I also think if people want to use the cloud then I say go ahead but I think the traditional buying and loading onto a pc should always be the way it is. I see this slow creep toward cloud based software. Many companies are doing it. All I can say is when companies do this they are going to push people away and they will find alternative software that allows people to 'own' an actual product. This concept of ownership will never go out of style.Quote:
Originally Posted by handrawn
Xara Cloud is one nascent example and while it does not have the same functionality as the feature-rich Xara Desktop applications, it may one day.
We have stated assurances from Xara that the Desktop applications are continuing to be developed and we have a Forum for Xara Cloud.
To better the Desktop application, try to use the free Starter Xara Cloud in collaboration with your Xara Desktop application and make recommendations on where Xara Cloud is short of or even missing the mark.
We have the chance to forge the Xara Cloud and better our beloved Xara Desktop applications. I have seen little positive contribution in the Xara Cloud Thread, mainly because of poor initial product definition so let's change that from now.
I am reminded when Acorn Computing Group plc went to the wall and Olivetti bought it, it asked what a particular test rig was. So began (my history is probably off) the Acorn Archimedes, the Risc PC and ARM RISC chips (one in almost every Smarthhone in use).
Make Xara Great Again.
Acorn
@ daver1
depends of course on whether you own a pc/mac - for example, many people do not, and do everything on their phone/tablet
on balance, when you look at the whole market across all disciplines and users of whatever discipline or generation, I don't see cloud reducing the number of users; in certain catagories it may, but there again in others the opposite will be true
ownership is not going to go out of style, true - but then neither is providing a service for those who do not have the time or inclination to maintain their own system[s]
I don't see it is an either/or - I see it as a choice
As far as magixara are concerned they are offering this choice; early days yet with the cloud, dragging feet with the desktop, but the choice is still there
internet activation is to [help] prevent piracy and the use of hacked software...
no layersQuote:
Originally Posted by acorn
no smart grouping
no bitmap tracer
no blend tool
no mould tool
no.....
well you get the idea ;)
I do indeed but with Xara it has to be larded on: what you have tried to achieve, what is missing in Xara Cloud, what would better it and why. One fix at a time.Quote:
Originally Posted by handrawn
All very tedious but necessary.
In the PowerPoint substitute user story, Xara Cloud does not handle step or slide transitions. I bemoaned this and had an email back saying Xara GmbH is on the case.
A small acknowledgement for me and a better product for Xara.
Once Xara "rediscovers" TG excellence and expertise, it might start listening properly across the board.
Ever hopeful,
Acorn
When I started this thread I did so with the intention of stating how I viewed the cloud concept as a users 'program' on a home based computer. I see little sense in using a cloud based software. It's like having a meal but you can't actually eat it because it is not in front of you. It's on someone else's table. The concept is strange. I see no reason why anyone would want that. That's why when I see someone trying to pitch the idea as beneficial as rather odd. It goes against the norm. It comes down to ownership that of buying a product and actually getting one. The idea of the cloud is a money generator in that one must keep paying to use the service. That's why ownership as in having possession of a product is the desired way to go. And why people are so vocal about ownership vrs leasing a service. My intention is to make it plain and clear to Xara/Magix if you go this route and Neglect the desktop or try to make it more cloud like you will lose customers in a major way. Affinity Designer has already taken many customers away from you. Basically if you are in this for the money stick to the traditional desktop product. But hey companies don't listen many times they listen to some people with a 'big idea' and end up running things into the ground. The problem is once people get tired enough they move on to other programs. Hopefully someone from Xara will take heed..
@acorn
eleven years I have been a member here, fifteen years I have been using xara software; there are others such as youself and gary who's usage goes back quite a bit further....
I remember Zeb saying a year or three ago that he did not care whether the interface was dark or light or whatever, because he spent hardly anytime looking at it, he was looking at the work....
similarly I do not care which program I use just so long as it is cost-effective, efficient and has the tools I need
I hope you get takers for the task in hand, but whilst on the one hand I would not wish to go back to a cloud-less project management system, as far as asset creation goes I no longer use xara enough to merit the effort.....
@daver1
I have a better analogy - cloud is like a public transport system rather than owning your own car - did i own a car when I lived and worked in London: no way
Cloud has not done MS or Adobe any harm, I don't see why it should Magixara if they get it right....
@handrawn Not everyone has a public transport system. In America we have to own cars. We would be in trouble without one. Unless we lived in NYC. I still want my meals in front of me it tastes better that way :DQuote:
Originally Posted by handrawn
you are entitled to do what you want :D
BTW we don't necessarily have good or any public transport outside of conurbation in the UK; the analogy was one of service industry vrs ownership which is what it's really about?
Steve, I was aware we don't "own" the software. That's why I used the inverted comma's. The point I was making, was that I want "forever" software. That will work with my machine rather than have to buy it every year.
Also, and there may be LOTS of people disagree with me, but I don't even want updates (bug fixes, yes, but probably as downloadable patches). I want software that works and stays exactly as it was when I bought it. I dislike the idea that the software is updated until it no longer runs on my computer, and then I have to buy a new computer, and then the software is updated until it no longer runs on my computer, and then ... which is what windows is doing all the time.
People think their computers are getting slower, but it's not the case ... the software is getting updated, and using more of the resources, thus making the computers appear slower. They are ALWAYS the same speed as they were when they were bought.
sure Keith... and of course, philosophically speaking no-one owns anything, and nothing is forever... or at least you can't base your life on that, bad kama
I agree about constant updating being a pain - my andriod phone keep doing it, I don't want/need most of the apps and I don't need google ass[istant]
minor quibble - if your computer is solid state you have a fair point about the speed - but if it has platter HDDs these start to wear and slow down after time because they cannot physically access the data as fast as they age
Keith, I understand the position of the first idea but eventually things do evolve or stagnate. My complaints with Xara have been we didn't buy into the Cloud for Xara to hide away what we thought was "forever" in terms of content: downloaded content was forever with version 10. It is cheaper and effortless to provide ongoing access to a Cloud repository forever. Then, the allure to new Customers is the mother-lode of several Gigabytes of rich Xara-centric content. It should not be leased back year-on-year like Dane Gelt for those who decide to stick with an application that is already adequate for their purposes.Quote:
Originally Posted by ss-kalm
Acorn
Admittedly, but at that point, I have the option of buying evolved software further down the line, when my current software no longer fits my requirements.
I admit that they do wear and slow down, but is it noticeable?Quote:
Originally Posted by handrawn
Keith, exactly and you shouldn't have the hiatus of no access to content in the gap. Rather Xara should be marketing its new benefits after inviting your input for new features.Quote:
Originally Posted by ss-kalm
A two-way street.
Acorn
if you have disk intensive work - eg database, real-time video editing, I'd say yesQuote:
Originally Posted by ss-kalm
otherwise it will depend how many process' you have running in the background....
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