Would like to buy a beginner-level DSLR - need help

Hi...

I have been using a point-and-shoot camera with tripod and photo tent to build my gallery on my website (www.stoppersnstuff.net). I continue to be really unhappy with the coloring coming out of the camera (I know that this is not what the p&s cameras are meant for). I would really like to buy a beginner's DSLR that will take truer colored photographs and works well on closeups (within the photo tent). I have been looking at Nikon D3100, D5100, and the Canon rebel t3i. But the problem that I have been reading about is that the standard lens that comes with all of these cameras are not suited for closeups. I realistically spend at least 10 minutes a photo, using Corel Photoshop X4, trying to get the colors more realistic.

I would really appreciate any recommendations that anyone has about which is a better camera to start out with as well as the type of lens I would need to get if I was just buying the camera box and getting the lens separate.

I am hoping to take some camera classes this summer at a local community college after purchasing the camera.

Thanks in advance for any assistance anyone can provide.

Dave

It might be a problem with your lighting rather than the camera. What lighting rig do you have?

Hi....

Thanks for your quick response. I'm not using any artificial lighting... I use natural light under an awning to cut down on the glare.

Dave

How about a before and after?

I usually clear out my Corel auto-preserve but I did find one that is fairly representative... This is an ambrosia maple bowl... Attachment 90177Attachment 90178.

The one designated sign2 is the result after lightening it up a bit and cutting down on the color. It's still not completely accurate but it is closer to the actual color. The problem also is that the coloring and lightness/darkness of the woods I photograph were not consistant, even during the same day. It's really frustrating.

I have shown my photos to a professional sports photographer and he agrees that the quality of the photos are not good. He did say that often it was the person behind the lens, which I can probably concur with, but he also said that the sensors in the p&s cameras are not normally configured for closeup shots... I always check the white balance to ensure that I am specifying full sun or shade (depending on the light).

Thanks in advance.

Dave

My feeling is that you'd be better off with a better lighting system, rather than an expensive camera. If you do a lot of product photography you can make or buy a simple lightbox, to evenly light the product. It can be as simple as a couple of natural light bulbs and a sheet.

I can't help but think that buying a new camera might leave you in the same place.

The image shows quite a harsh shadow. Is the natural light very bright, or was it a flash?

I think some experiments with a light sheet and some home made foil refectors could boost the image. You can buy pop-up white boxes, designed for just this kind of work.

This product shot shows the kind of arrangement people use to take product shots: http://www.amazon.com/Perfect-Platin.../ref=pd_cp_p_2 . I am not endorsing that product.

You could also ask a photography student or member of a local photography society to come over and give you a few ideas. If Nothing else, you can see how much difference using a better DSLR would be.

Nice woodwork!

Thanks for everyone's responses. I am using a lightbox with a gradient background (Cowboy studio). The photo was taken on our back porch with natural light. The light was indirect. I was using a sony DSC-W60 point and shoot. I had modified the white balance to specify natural light (cloudy). When i first got the cowboy studio light box with lights (they were the energy saver bulbs) I tried it indoors with and without the flash. In both cases I modified the white balance to indoor incandescent and the colors were terrible. I got bad glare from the flash. I moved the camera further back and used the zoom. Unfortunately by the time I was able to eliminate the glare, the optical zoom went to digital and the photos were very grainy. That's why i started to take the photos outdoors.

One point that I did not mention earlier... at a craft show we did last weekend, that I showed my works, a photographer with a canon rebel t2i came by the booth and wanted to take a couple of pictures. I told him of course if he wouldn't mind emailing them to me. He agreed. Curiously, standing about 2 feet away from the wood (under our tent in shade) the photos (against a black background) were spot on. The color was exact. I guess that is why I thought part of my problem was the point and shoot camera. I had my camera with me at the show and I proceeded to take a photo of the same woods. I adjusted the white balance to reflect outdoor shade, and took the photos. The color of the wood was off. The photographer then tried to take the photos using my camera. He left the white balance as it was, but started messing around with the EV mode (not sure what that is). He was able to get closer to the actual color, but it still was not that close. He suggested that the point and shoot cameras normally do not have as accurate sensor which could account for the difference.

I know some of this has to be my doing, but the coloration of the wood is so off, that I have to believe that some of that is the camera. On the photos that I submitted earlier, notice that I lightened up the second photo to more accurately represent the color of the wood. But the background ended up more blue than grey (which I don't really understand).

Thanks again.. This has been a big learning experience for me so far.

Dave

Hi Dave

A couple of ideas for you :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNxBGXTbdXE

http://digital-photography-school.com/how-to-make-a-inexpensive-light-tent

I would go for daylight LED bulbs for correct colour and safety. Hot bulbs and combustible materials don't mix.

Hi Drwyd....

I am already using a Cowboy studio light tent. I originally took photos indoors using the lights supplied with the light tent, but the color of the wood was off.. that's why I tried to use the light tent out on our porch using natural light.

Dave

The specs on your camera show only "auto" for the white balance settings. As natural light will always have a variable colour cast this will cause problems. You are trying to hit a moving target :)

I've used a Fuji Finepix F47fd for quite a while (currently on Ebay for as little as £5) lovely little camera. That should be all you need for web work.

http://www.cameras.co.uk/specs/fuji-finepix-f47fd.cfm

Hi....

I am definitely not having a good day.... I have the DSC-W80 not the W60 (sorry... should have checked my spelling). It does have 7 white balance modes (Taken from http://www.ehow.com/list_7637522_tips-sony-dscw80.html: "The Sony DSC-W80 has seven manual white balance settings, plus a default "Auto White Balance" mode. From According to its test results, the website Digital Photography Review determined that it's better to set the white balance using the manual presets versus using the auto mode. In both the "Fluorescent" and "Incandescent" settings, the camera's color reproduction was more accurate using those settings versus the "Auto" setting. In the "Auto" setting, the images had a very noticeable yellow tinge to them.")

I know that some of this is me... but when the gentleman in the booth couldn't get my camera to show representative color of the woodturnings, I felt that some of this was due to the camera.

I'll continue to play with the camera and the settings, but if you look at the photos on my website, I had to modify them via Corel photo shop to get their color close to what it actually was. My major concern is when I eventually am able to set up a store on my website, the color of the wood needs to be pretty exact. If I have to spend a lot of time on multiple photos to get them looking proper, I wonder if a better camera would cut down on the time I always have to spend.

Thanks for everyone's patience with me...

Dave


Read more: Tips on the Sony DSC-W80 | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/list_7637522_tip...#ixzz1xQtDOqSo

I'd stick with the camera awhile. Never use the flash and get some daylight coloured bulbs/LEDs. Turn off other lights.

Thanks for everyone's responses. I am going to continue to mess around with the current camera and hope I can figure out the right settings to get the photographs looking more accurate, colorwise.

Dave

You might need to calibrate your monitor, you'll rarely see the same colours on your computer screen as you see in real life without proper calibration.
Then, after you have done that you will need to understand that everyone else in the world looking at your website photos may not be seeing the true colours, but then - they would not be the wiser.

I was a wood turner/wood crafter for many years before the time of digital cameras, I always photographed my work outside in natural light or under a window.
► https://dl.dropbox.com/u/250070/Phot...us_bowl1x1.jpg

The FinePix F660EXR would probably do a good job.

The HS20EXR is also tempting :)

I think Dave's existing camera is as equal to the job as any other point and shoot, and certainly overkill for the intended use - web page imagery.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sledger

You might need to calibrate your monitor, you'll rarely see the same colours on your computer screen as you see in real life without proper calibration.
Then, after you have done that you will need to understand that everyone else in the world looking at your website photos may not be seeing the true colours, but then - they would not be the wiser.

I was a wood turner/wood crafter for many years before the time of digital cameras, I always photographed my work outside in natural light or under a window.
► https://dl.dropbox.com/u/250070/Phot...us_bowl1x1.jpg

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That doesn't look like an unlit piece to me Steve - you sure?

Yes it is lit, by the sun of course ;)
► https://dl.dropbox.com/u/250070/Photos/trike1x1.jpg

My camera in those days was a cheapo Russian Zenit 35mm. No built-in flash (not even a battery inside, anywhere!)
If digital cameras were around in those days I would have photographed everything I produced, the cost and time involved with processing mean't I didn't and sadly I only have a handful of printed photos left now due to the slides I preferred at the time having since gone blue and mouldy.

But that's enough about me, this is Dave's thread :)

Remarkable. The shadow is quite strong and the background quite dark, so fooled me!

Nice to meet another turner out here... That's a really pretty simple bowl you turned and it looks great. I'm going to stick with my camera for now. I just need to figure out the limited settings I can use to try to get the color more representative. I spend a lot of time on Corel to get the colors close. I shouldn't have to do that..

Thanks to everyone for talking me out of a rather large expense. I'll keep working using the Sony I have...

Dave

I have an EOS30D but if the lighting is rubbish then the camera cannot do magic for you. I built a lightbox and put aluminium foil on the left and right insides to try and get the light to bounce around more. I have been quite happy with the results. I'm still using the standard lens that came with it but for very close up work I simply added a couple of stepping rings. You get great depth of field and real close zoom. But I'm no expert so my experience stops there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sledger

Yes it is lit, by the sun of course ;)
► https://dl.dropbox.com/u/250070/Photos/trike1x1.jpg

My camera in those days was a cheapo Russian Zenit 35mm.)

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Wow! The first person I've seen that even knows about that camera! I had one in the mid-1976's! What a BRICK! LOL! Thanks for bringing back some cool memories! :)

Dave,

Two things.

First, you will find that you can get perfect color if you invest in a system, either card or plastic cube, that has White/Black/Grey patches that you can use to set perfect White balance after-the-fact. Q-Card is an inexpensive printed card system. But, my favorite is the SpyderCube from DataColor. It is a plastic cube having white, absolute black and grey features. It's works magically to allow you to use PhotoShop to pop the colors into place with three simple dropper clicks.

Secondly, shoot in RAW rather than JPG. That is probably not possible with your current camera. RAW give you a LOT more control over the colors when processing your images. Most all of the dSLR cameras provide you with the ability to shoot in RAW. The Canon series goes one better by giving you a free tool to process the RAW images with a few simple clicks. If you do want to try an SLR, then I'd suggest the new T4i as a wonderful choice. I no longer use Photoshop for processing my images because Digital Photo Professional that comes with Canon cameras is so easy and good.

As for depth of field issues, take a look at photo stacking applications like Helicon focus. ALL cameras have limited field of view and products like Helicon Focus can be used to over come those limitations.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mvssysprog

Hi...

I have been using a point-and-shoot camera with tripod and photo tent to build my gallery on my website (www.stoppersnstuff.net). I continue to be really unhappy with the coloring coming out of the camera (I know that this is not what the p&s cameras are meant for). I would really like to buy a beginner's DSLR that will take truer colored photographs and works well on closeups (within the photo tent). I have been looking at Nikon D3100, D5100, and the Canon rebel t3i. But the problem that I have been reading about is that the standard lens that comes with all of these cameras are not suited for closeups. I realistically spend at least 10 minutes a photo, using Corel Photoshop X4, trying to get the colors more realistic.

I would really appreciate any recommendations that anyone has about which is a better camera to start out with as well as the type of lens I would need to get if I was just buying the camera box and getting the lens separate.

I am hoping to take some camera classes this summer at a local community college after purchasing the camera.

Thanks in advance for any assistance anyone can provide.

Dave

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Can you Pm me some pics, other details and exact price you want

Burone - You are a new member and cannot receive PMs until you have made more posts. I think it's around 10-15 posts.

Dave, it's been over four months now - how goes things on the photography front?

Paul