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Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
I am Leaving Xara Web Designer... because of the massive frustration I am having with the program... and its idiosyncrasies.... and jumbled workarounds... and conflicting information here on the forums.
I have spent over 80 hours trying to make a fairly simple web site with cascading menus. Ive actually paid people to help me with Xara and their work has been as unpredictable as the program, and Ive had several people kind enough to try to help me off-line..and "Thank You" to them....but to no avail...My web site is dead, unworkable and unstable.
I am NOT COMING BACK till Xara makes a corporate commitment to make a comprehensive, bulletproof, non-assuming, easy to understand, not missing any steps, explaining it all, beginners TRAINING VIDEO on how to master its menu buttons, rollovers, popups and ESPECIALLY its cascading menu methodology with the 10 rules you must implement to make it work.
I am tired of workarounds, mis-information, corrections, and temporarily wrong information. There are a large number of very dedicated, helpful, and intelligent people working with integrity here in the forum...but I dont think I can take working with XWD any further till the company comes out with a major fix release or some training that doesnt talk over our heads like this all works just simply fine...and forgets to tell us 5 steps in between that MUST be followed...
Ill be back maybe in a month maybe...after I have cooled down with the frustrations with V5.01 of this software...and the jumble of well meaning unsuccessful workarounds.
Suzzie
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Hello Suzzie,
I only use XWD to make multiple, templates or websites to show my cutomers and then work it out with an other programm like dreamweaver.
XWD is fantastic to quikley make graphics, bannerads headings, buttons, and even menu's. Althoug I don't use menus often because of the SEO.
SE have difficulties to index you pages when using pre build menu's.
So my advice is to use it for graphics, and building templates or previeuws for your customers.
Don't turn your back to XWD. It's great and cheap ....
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Hello Suzzie,
I'm sure that if you upload your .web file and tell us in more details what your problems are that people will step in and help you to solve them. :)
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Suzzie, your experience seems very much at odds with the vast majority of XWD users.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Attaching a current .web file will allow forum members to help move you forward in your design efforts. Some issues just can't be resolved without an independent voice (or set of external perspectives). Personally, I'm happy to offer what I can to help you through whatever problems you might be experiencing (sounds like navigation issues). :)
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Suzzie,
It is easy to get frustrated with computing! I think it would be fair to say, we have all been there! I would encourage you to take up the kind offers of forum members to help you.
My concern is where you are going wrong in XWD because the templates supplied give you ample scope to make a simple web page and upload it.
If you switch to another programme you will have the same trouble and probably more.
Give it another go.
Rupert
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Thanks all for your kind words of encouragement. I have been unable to make cascading navigation bars that work and look good. I tried using ones from the gallery and modifying them...and from what I have read that may be some of the challenge.
Between templates, and dragging, and aligning, and ungrouping, and changing type, and re-aligning, and making layers, and making links, and making certain kinds of special layers, and moving, and naming conventions, and popups, and rollovers, and soft grouping, and grouping, and repeating, and updating...its all been a bit too much for me...ive spent nearly 2 weeks of self learning here and with the help file trying to make it work successfully and be stable. Some seem to say here that navigation buttons are conceptually easy to do...not in my case.
I must apologize...I DO think that there is a lot of great things in XWD... and the idea is brilliant, but until the factory comes up with an update addressing these distinct critical 17 steps in button production...or makes a comprehensive, miss no steps video...then ive got to cut my bait and stop fishing. All im trying to do is make 8 rollover nav buttons and 5 of them have sub menus in them of 2, 3 and 5 levels under them... linking to other pages. For the life of me...ive spent hours, and hours, and hours, trying to get them to work successfully without any ultimate success.
Thanks for all your encouragement...maybe after I have cooled down a bit...ill come back here briefly and see whats up. I wrote a letter to support this weekend...ill see what they have to say as well.
Cheers,
Suzzie
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
In these kinds of situations I usually take a step back and make a small example to show that what I'm trying to do will or will not work. When I've done that I can either get it to work and understand where I've gone wrong or I can pass it to the community for help.
That may help you more. If you showed what one of your menus should look like, I'm sure you'd get some help, also.
Paul
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
I'm currently taking a few minutes to create a very simple looking navigation system that has Suzzie's eight buttons — five of which will have drop-down menus. I'll post the final .web file, and will write up step by step documentation on how to replicate the same.
Will post again after a little while ...
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Since there is a 5000 character limit to the length of a single post, the navbar tutorial that I'm writing will have to be broken into multiple posts. The first part will handle the creation of the first eight button. The second part will explain how to use popup layers (and their companion rollover layers) to build drop-down menus. The third and final section will show a more efficient proceedure for batch processing the layer changes.
I've attached the .web file to this post. :cool:
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Navbar tutorial
PART 1
the .web file is attached to post #10
In this navbar tutorial there will be eight menu items, or buttons. We'll number the buttons 1 through 8, for simplicity. While buttons 1, 3, 4, 5 and 7 will have dropdown menus, buttons 2, 6 and 8 will not.
Each menu choice has a mouse-off (static/dormant) state and a mouse-over (highlight) state. The mouse-off state is what is what the user sees when the mouse cursor is not over the button. The mouse-over state is the highlighted state that the user sees when the mouse cursor is anywhereon the button.
In this primer, the mouse-off state and the mouse-over state each have a rectangle and a text string which are grouped togther.
For all buttons without dropdown menus, the mouse-off group will be placed on the MouseOff layer. The mouse-over group will be placed on the MouseOver layer.
For all buttons with dropdown menus, popup layers must be created and properly used. Additionally, each popup layer will have its own mouse-over layer.
Start by creating a set of new layers in the Layer Gallery. And for proper rollover effects, they will need to be ordered properly from bottom to top.mouseOver_btn7
btn7
mouseOver_btn5
btn5
mouseOver_btn4
btn4
mouseOver_btn3
btn3
mouseOver_btn1
btn1
MouseOver
MouseOff
As was mentioned above, a pair of layers are required for each button that has a dropdown menu. Additional layers are not needed for buttons that have no dropdown menus. For this reason, you see no special layers for buttons 2, 6 or 8.
Note that for each popup layer (btn1, btn3, btn4, btn5 and btn7) there is a corresponding mouse-over layer directly above. The rollover layer name [i]absolutely must[i] have "mouseover" as its first eight letters (not case-sensitive).
Make the first button- Make the MouseOff layer the current layer.
- Create a black rectangle (50x22) with no border.
- Add center-justified, 13pix, white text.
- Center the two items within selection bounds (use Ctrl+Shift+L).
- Group together (Ctrl+G) the rectangle and the white text.
- Clone the group (Ctrl+K).
- Using the Layer Gallery, make the MouseOver layer the current layer.
- With the cloned group selected, move it to the MouseOver layer by clicking the Move button at the top of the Layer Gallery.
- Hit ESC to deselect the group.
- Ctrl+click on the the rectangle portion of the button (not the text). The status line will read, "1 rectangle 'inside' on layer MouseOver".
- Right-mouse-click on any color (on the color bar) that you want to use for your mouse-over highlight, then select "Set fill color".
- With the first set of mouse-off and mouse-over button elements created and on proper layers, let's apply a soft-group. Marquee-select both objects. The status bar at the bottom left of your Web Designer window should read, "2 groups on 2 layers".
- Do an Arrange > Apply Soft Group. The status bar should read, "2 groups (Soft Group) on 2 layers".
- Right-mouse-click on the soft grouped button and open Web Properties. Click on the Link tab. In the Link to Web address field, type # (Shift+3). Click the Apply button. This applies a temporary link that will allow these soft-grouped elements to behave like a button. Leave the Web Properties dialog open.
- Test the button function by clicking the Preview button. Moving your mouse cursor across the button should stimulate the group on the MouseOver layer.
Duplicate the buttons
Now that we have a single, working button, we can move forward. Doing this first means that we don't have to run through this process for each and every button. (What a nightmare THAT would be ...)
Make sure that your button is where you want your first button to be on the web page. On the info bar, check the Position XY values. It's not a bad idea to edit those values so that they are integers.
Make sure that both the MouseOff and MouseOver layers are both visible and unlocked in the Layer Gallery.
Create your second button by selecting your button (soft-grouped) and typing Ctrl+K (this will make a clone of your button, in exactly the same position, and with its elements on precisely the same layers.) Shift the button to the right by holding down the Ctrl key and hitting the right arrow key 11 times (that's 55 pixels).
Marquee-select the two buttons, then hit Ctrl+K to create additional copies. Shift the buttons to the right by holding down the Ctrl key and hitting the right arrow key 22 times.
Do the same to create and position the last four buttons.
Edit the text string of each button. Note that because the buttons are soft-grouped, changing the text value on either layer will automatically change the text string on the other layer.
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Navbar tutorial
PART 2
the .web file is attached to post #10
Create Popup Menu Items
With the Snap to objects mode active, create duplicates of each button and position them as needed. You can do this by right-mouse dragging the original buttons (this is a cloning shortcut). Move your cursor to the upper-left corner of the button, click & drag to the lower-left corner of the same button. This will snap exactly on the corner. To verify, you can check the Position XY values on the infobar. - For button 1, add three buttons.
- For button 3, add two buttons.
- For button 4, add four buttons.
- For button 5, add three buttons.
- For button 7, add two buttons.
Edit all drop-down button labels as 1a, 1b, 1c, etc. Remember that because the buttons are soft-grouped, changing the text value on either layer will automatically change the text string on the other layer.
Moving Groups To Popup Layers
(and their companion rollover layers)
With all layers unlocked and visible, marquee-select all buttons. Do an Arrange > Remove Soft Group. This is so that we can conveniently access the groups on different layers, to reposition them onto their popup layers. We'll soft-group them again later.
OK ... here's the fun stuff. :)
Top Level Buttons
Since buttons 2, 6 and 8 don't have drop-down menus, we can leave them alone. For the other top-level buttons (1, 3, 4, 5 and 7), you'll need to follow these steps:- Move the MouseOver group to its popup layer. For button 1, that would mean that the colored rectangle that's grouped with its white text moves to the btn1 layer.
- Leave the MouseOff group (the black rectangle that's grouped with its white text) where it is, but add a trigger to stimulate its popup layer.
Drop-down Buttons
Follow these steps to properly place the drop-down button groups on layers:- Move the MouseOver group to its mouseover-popup layer. For buttons 1a 1b and 1c that would mean that the colored rectangle that's grouped with its white text moves to the mouseOver_btn1 layer.
- Move the MouseOff group to its popup layer. For buttons 1a 1b and 1c that would mean that the black rectangle that's grouped with its white text moves to the btn1 layer.
Making Adjustments To Button 1
(and its drop-down buttons)
Let's go ahead and move the groups for the button 1 family:- Make the MouseOver layer selectable and visible. Lock all other layers and make them invisible.
- Select colored button 1. The status line should read, "1 group on layer MouseOver". Activate the popup layer that you created called btn1, then click on the Move button at the top of the gallery. The colored button object will immediately disappear, since it has been moved to an invisible layer.
- Marquee-select colored buttons 1a, 1b and 1c. The status line should read, "3 groups on layer MouseOver". Activate the popup layer that you created called mouseOver_btn1, then click on the Move button at the top of the gallery. The three buttons will immediately disappear, since they have been moved to an invisible layer.
- Make the MouseOff layer selectable and visible. Lock all other layers and make them invisible.
- Marquee-select black buttons 1a, 1b and 1c. The status line should read, "3 groups on layer MouseOff". Activate the popup layer that you created called btn1, then click on the Move button at the top of the gallery. The three buttons will immediately disappear, since they have been moved to an invisible layer.
- Select the black button 1. The status line should read, "1 group on layer MouseOff". Stimulate the popup layer with Web Properties > Mouse-over (tab) > Show popup layer [ btn1 ]
Test button 1 and it's drop-down by clicking on the Preview button.
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Navbar tutorial
PART 3
the .web file is attached to post #10
Processing Buttons 3, 4, 5 and 7
(and their drop-down buttons)
Instead of handing one button at a time, let's look at a more efficient process:- Move the colored buttons
- Set MouseOver as selectable/visible.
Set all others as locked/invisible. - Select colored button 3.
Click btn3 in the Layer Gallery.
Click the Move button. - Select colored button 4.
Click btn4 in the Layer Gallery.
Click the Move button. - Select colored button 5.
Click btn5 in the Layer Gallery.
Click the Move button. - Select blue button 7.
Click btn7 in the Layer Gallery. - Marquee-select colored buttons 3a and 3b.
Click mouseOver_btn3 in the Layer Gallery.
Click the Move button. - Marquee-select colored buttons 4a 4b 4c and 4d.
Click mouseOver_btn4 in the Layer Gallery.
Click the Move button. - Marquee-select colored buttons 5a 5b and 5c.
Click mouseOver_btn5 in the Layer Gallery.
Click the Move button. - Marquee-select colored buttons 71 and 7b.
Click mouseOver_btn7 in the Layer Gallery.
Click the Move button.
Move the black buttons- Set MouseOff as selectable/visible.
Set all others as locked/invisible. - Select black button 3.
- Web Properties > Mouse-over (tab) > Show popup layer [ btn3 ] (click Apply)
- Select black button 4.
- Web Properties > Mouse-over (tab) > Show popup layer [ btn4 ] (click Apply)
- Select black button 5.
- Web Properties > Mouse-over (tab) > Show popup layer [ btn5 ] (click Apply)
- Select black button 7.
- Web Properties > Mouse-over (tab) > Show popup layer [ btn7 ] (click Apply)
Test the entire menu system by clicking the Preview button.
You can create duplicate web pages, with navigation intact, with the Edit > Pages > Duplicate current page. Once you have your pages created, don't forget to replace the temporary # link with an appropriate Web Properties > Link (tab) > Link to page [ page name ].
Note that there isn't any soft-grouping right now, yet the menu system works just fine. If you want to be able to edit a text string on one layer, and have the other layer automatically change, then you'll want to go back and soft-group your buttons. Soft-grouping also comes in handy when moving your buttons around and keeping all of its elements together and in alignment.
All in all, once the basics sink in, buttons and menus are not difficult to construct. Making the sample .web file took me about 20 minutes. It did, though, require a learning curve.
Perhaps someone can put present this proceedure as video tutorial. (Slavelle does a great job!)
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Certainly, if errors are found in the proceedure above, let me know and I'm sure they can be corrected.
Good luck all. :)
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Curtis you have gone to a lot of effort in the above three posts.
May I suggest that you create a single PDF for members to download (via a link in your signature)?
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Good idea, Steve. Until I do the PDF file, I'll put a link in my signature to the opening post of the tutorial. :)
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Maybe it is just as easy, could you add just 1 move level to one of the 2nd tiers, to make it three?
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Things get just a little bit more complicated when a third level is added. To illustrate how this is done however, I have added a 3rd level to just one of the 2nd tier buttons (4c). Horizontally, I kept it in line with button 5, for asthetics. You'll note that there is no interruption in flow as you move your mouse cursor from button 4c to 4c¹. This is because I've added a 99% transparent rectangle between the two.
This is how it's done:- Create a new layer called btn4c and position it at the top of the [b]Layer Gallery[/url].
- Create its complementary rollover layer called mouseOver_btn4c, making sure that is stacked immediately on top of btn4c.
- Create the first button on this 3rd tier fly-out menu by marquee-selecting around button 4d ... making sure that its two layers (btn4 and mouseOver_btn4) are both visible and selectable. The status line should read "2 groups on 2 layers" (provided you haven't yet re-soft-grouped your buttons yet). Create a clone (Ctrl+K).
- Position the button's two groups by tapping holding down the Ctrl key, then tapping the right arrow key 11 times (55 pixels).
- Change the text for both groups (on 2 layers) to "4c¹" (or whatever you want).
- Marquee-select both groups and Arrange > Apply Soft Group.
- Duplicate the new button and attach the copy to the bottom and in line with the first button. Change it's text to "4c²" (or whatever you like). Remember that at this point your buttons are soft-grouped. This requires that you only change one of the two text elements, and the other will be changed automatically.
- Create a third button by repeating the same steps.
- Once your three buttons are created, do an Arrange > Remove Soft Group. This makes it much easier to move the groups to their new layers.
Move the gouped objects to their new layers
- Make mouseOver_btn4c selectable/visible.
Make all other layers locked/invisible. - Select the three colored buttons (4c¹ 4c² and 4c³). The status line should read, "3 groups on layer mouseOver_btn4".
- Select the mouseOver_btn4c layer in the Layer Gallery, then hit the Move button at the top of the gallery.
- Make btn4 selectable/visible.
Make all other layers locked/invisible. - Select the three black buttons (4c¹ 4c² and 4c³). The status line should read, "3 groups on layer btn4".
- Select the btn4c layer in the Layer Gallery, then hit the Move button at the top of the gallery.
- Make mouseOver_btn4 selectable/visible.
Make that all other layers locked/invisible. - Select colored button 4c. the status line should read, "1 group on layer mouseOver_btn4".
- Select the btn4c layer in the Layer Gallery, then hit the Move button at the top of the gallery.
Assign a popup trigger - Make btn4 selectable/visible.
Make that all other layers locked/invisible. - Select black button 4c, and apply popup trigger:
Web Properties > Mouse-over (tab) > Show popup layer [ btn4c ].
And lastly ... - Add the 99% transparent bridging rectangle on btn4c and position it between buttons 4c and 4c¹.
I don't think I left anything out. If I did, please advise. Thanks. :)
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
I would basically take two things from this:
1) Do you really need such cumbersome menus in the first place? They are pretty much out of fashion for web navigation.
2) If you do, then perhaps XWD 1.0 isn't the right tool for the job.
[This isn't a criticism of Curtis, or the tutorial]
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
I would agree with Paul.
Why the need for such a complex drop menu? I use an Index page like in a book with any number of buttons to select links to other pages and articles.
The above comment is in no way meant to detract from the tute by Curtis. I want to compliment Curtis on his work and effort put into the tutorial.
Great job!
Rupert
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
I agree with the two of you.
If you want to use Xara Web Designer as a production tool (for realtively simple websites), and you don't want creation/maintenance nightmares, then seriously consider keeping everything on the MouseOff and MouseOver layers. Whatever you might place on the [multi-level]dropdown menus, consider putting on a secondary system, as a left-hand column menu. I'll have to work up an example.
While it has been challenging and enlightening learning this layering system, it representa way too much work for the Xara Web Designer's target market.
Perhaps tomorrow I'll construct an alternative navigation system (equal in fuction to what has already been constructed) that only involves the MouseOff and MouseOver layers (substantially simplifying web page creation).
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Certainly, third-level menus are not worth it. The proceedure delineated in post #18 would have to be duplicated for each and every 3rd level mini-menu strain. :eek:
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Hi,
I agree with Paul theat many menus on a website I leave the site fast...if not faster..than fast..
Jim
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Wow! That's a nicely detailed tutorial. I cannot wait till I get it in PDF or better yet in a detailed video. Bravo!
I do think however, that this illustrates the point suzzie1234 orginally made about there being so many steps. It is easy to get lost or frustrated when learning all this stuff. Personally, I still have alot of troubles when it comes to changing the text in the buttons. It is getting better now, but sometimes I still get lost.
I will continue learning it though. It is still easier for me to create with XWD than to take my XWD art and turn it into some sort of hand coded navbar.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Quote:
Originally Posted by
robobugs
I do think however, that this illustrates the point suzzie1234 orginally made about there being so many steps.
Quite right, but this is a really old-fasioned way to navigate and you'll struggle to find any major website using menus like that - for good reason.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Great job, Curtis. You must now have a complete grasp of layers and multi-level menus!
I hope that upcoming versions of XWD and Xtreme will contain the right (easy) tools to add levels to a menu. Despite the fact that multi-level menus have become less popular, there is still a need/use for them and sometimes they are preferable over a secondary menu (e.g., in the case of only two or three links).
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
You can have the similar access to a multi-page website, but without the complexity of popup layers (each with their own rollover layers). The attached example has the same eight top level buttons, and there is the same number of sub choices. In this case, however, only the MouseOff and MouseOver layers are used for navigation ... MUCH simpler.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pauland
but this is a really old-fasioned way to navigate and you'll struggle to find any major website using menus like that.
What formats are currently recognized as modern/evolved and efficient, Paul (or anyone else, for that matter).
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cursor
You can have the similar access to a multi-page website, but without the complexity of popup layers (each with their own rollover layers). The attached example has the same eight top level buttons, and there is the same number of sub choices. In this case, however, only the MouseOff and MouseOver layers are used for navigation ... MUCH simpler.
What formats are currently recognized as modern/evolved and efficient, Paul (or anyone else, for that matter).
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A common approach is to have a button bar with secondary choices that may appear horizontally under it or vertically on the left. It's possible to extend this to a third level with the left hand vertical buttons.
If you need to go deeper, then think carefully about the organisation.
As with all things, there's no guidelines that can't be broken. The really innovative sites turn this stuff on it's head.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Lots of people are complaining that this is much too much work ........ What are the alternatives? Do any of the standard web packages have a feature to simplify this? I'm asking because I have never seen any package that can create these complex drop down menu's on the fly, especially since the end users will probably need custom colours.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
With respect to improved implementation of navbars, note that covoxer (in April) indicated that "we are planing to add this feature in the following version." reference
I'm not sure when that will be, however.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ss-kalm
Lots of people are complaining that this is much too much work ........ What are the alternatives?
Well Keith, as we know Xara's own Menu Maker can do the job. ;)
Create your multi-level menu in there and paste the code into your Web Designer web page. This cheap ($24.99 US) and fast option was already suggested several times on the forum and could be of interest for some.
At least until Web Designer will have this - or similar - functionality integrated, as referred to by Cursor and others.
By the way, appreciate your time and energy in creating this tutorial, Cursor.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Try placeholders and Easy Button & Menu Creator (www.blumentals.net) ... I really do like Web Designer .... after using Xtreme, there is a minimal learning curve but I am not making hard work of it.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
I don't agree about the drop down menu being "out of style". There are still a ton of sites being produced that have them. That said, too complicated a menu system is obnoxious and unnecessary.
I DON'T like that horizontal menu of additional choices that comes up under a menu item. If you don't keep your mouse right in the horizontal track of items, then they typically all go away, and it's hard to associate them to the menu they go with (like what you were looking at/for) since all submenus show up in the same horizontal space, regardless of which item was selected.
People are used to this drop down menu interdfae because it's the way that every OS works to some degree, as well as most forums (look up at the top of this page at the search and quicklinks menus - and vbulletin is about the most popular forum around.
For me, the prebuilt options aren't optimal, as they have a certain look about them that I don't really care for - some too simple, and some create menus that look dated at best, with limited options for changes.
As mentioned above, it's not like it's EASY to create these using CSS either. In fact, just getting a basic nav bar to work and line up in all broswers can be quite an endevor. I've done several and each time, I want to tear my hair out by the roots with pixel alignment problems, etc.
Just do a search for "suckerfish" menus if you want to see what a pain it can be. However, from a maintenance perspective, once they are setup, it's pretty easy to reorganize, add, or delete menu items or add entirely new dropdowns without having to address the whole site.
I put together a video yesterday about how to EASILY build up a nav bar with drop downs, but keeping it VERY simple. the whole vid was only eight minutes long and created a basic nav bar with two drops, sticking to text hovers and simple graphics.
Unfortunately, my avi -> swf converter ate the file :( and I wasn't able to post it. For as many people as I've seen report how hard this is, I will likely redo the video to assist.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
I'll certainl look forward to the publication of your redone video, slavelle. As always, thanks for your input. =)
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Some sites, just as this one that was posted by jagweb7 in the "Show Us Your Sites" thread, are very suitable to use a multi-level navbar, because it allows very easy navigation to specific information that is searched for by the visitor.
Some sites require some more browsing to acquaint the visitor with the company, its services/products, its history etc. But this site seems to be aimed more at people who already know about the company but need some additional information about specific facts or events.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Doesn't display properly in Chrome for me.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Quote:
Originally Posted by
suzzie1234
I am Leaving Xara Web Designer... because of the massive frustration I am having with the program... and its idiosyncrasies.... and jumbled workarounds... and conflicting information here on the forums.
I have spent over 80 hours trying to make a fairly simple web site with cascading menus. Ive actually paid people to help me with Xara and their work has been as unpredictable as the program, and Ive had several people kind enough to try to help me off-line..and "Thank You" to them....but to no avail...My web site is dead, unworkable and unstable.
I am NOT COMING BACK till Xara makes a corporate commitment to make a comprehensive, bulletproof, non-assuming, easy to understand, not missing any steps, explaining it all, beginners TRAINING VIDEO on how to master its menu buttons, rollovers, popups and ESPECIALLY its cascading menu methodology with the 10 rules you must implement to make it work.
I am tired of workarounds, mis-information, corrections, and temporarily wrong information. There are a large number of very dedicated, helpful, and intelligent people working with integrity here in the forum...but I dont think I can take working with XWD any further till the company comes out with a major fix release or some training that doesnt talk over our heads like this all works just simply fine...and forgets to tell us 5 steps in between that MUST be followed...
Ill be back maybe in a month maybe...after I have cooled down with the frustrations with V5.01 of this software...and the jumble of well meaning unsuccessful workarounds.
Suzzie
That's interesting . . . . . I was able to do everything you had trouble with in less than 2 hours. Absolute beginner too :-)
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Quote:
Originally Posted by
infoseek
That's interesting . . . . . I was able to do everything you had trouble with in less than 2 hours. Absolute beginner too :-)
Two hours to create menus in any program isn't great. Suzzie does have a point and for anyone having problems it's easy to see things as being worse than they really are.
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
Well what a thread, firstly Cursor you are an absolute star always there to lend a hand and help out in any way you can I think your ace. On this occassion its a shame the op hasn't had the respect for you taking so much time to try and help out to even bother posting a reply to your hard work.
I haven't been around for a few weeks now busy creating websites for my client list with this fantastic software, allmy clients are quite a close knit community and know each other so when one website was updated they all wanted it doing great new for me.
Over complicated nav bars are just that over complicated not needed and a waste of everyones time, if Xara thought it would have been a useful feature Im sure they would have incorporated it esily some where along the line, however I think we shouldn't lose focus on what Xara is and who it is aimed at, to me (and I may be wrong) it has been designed with drag and drop capability to make life easy for the "inexperienced" web designer or home user, these bloated nav bars are certainly not something an inexperienced user should be looking to create.
I think this time this problem is outside the realm of what WD was designed to do, and as usual the absolute stars that monitor this forum are trying their hardest to find a workaround to keep people happy personally I wouldn't bother. If its that important for this person to have this bloated nav bar then she simply has 2 choices:
a/ Go away and learn all about Dreamweaver and Expression Web maybe in around 6 months she will have the necessary coding skills to achieve what she is after.
b/ Open the purse and pay a pro
To me this whole scenario is a simple as that, I may be looking at things wrong it wouldn't be the first time so appologies if you disagree with me that fact she hasn't even offered a simple thankyou to Cursor says it all to me frustration or not they guys here dont work for Xara and get no financial recompense for the hours they put in trying to help people simple manners cost nothing.
Well done Cursor patt on the back to you :)
I will find your tut extremely useful but have to say I try my hardest to stay away from these bloatlike features that at the end of the day have no clear benefit to anything anyhow.
Rant over..........
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Re: Leaving XWD Because of Immense Frustration
I think it's always best when we address issues and concerns and not get personal.