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At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Before I and likely many others whom are very dissapointed with the new upgrade prices,leaving this once great vector program,
I'd really like to hear some comments by Xara ltd.
What their reasons are for the increase in those prices and the way they go about it.
Furthermore I like to have all other members here at TG to give a plus one (+1) if they agree.
By this I mean also the members(moderators) who refrain themselves for commenting on these matters.
I think it's time to speak up.
Hans
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
+1 from me, Hans. I have commented long and loud here over the past year or so on this crass scheme of Magix/Xara. "Keep the Customer Satisfied" - my bottom!
Bob.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
+1
In another thread I already addressed this issue but here it is again in the hope that it is read by Xara. By the way, should this thread not be moved to the "Dear Xara" forum? Please, let's try to be civil about this and not have this thread become a shouting match.
Soon my copy of XDP X365 will be up for renewal as well and I also would like to know if the service charge is indeed 129 euros (when renewing before the date of expiration) or 159 thereafter.
On the Xara's Update page the following is mentioned:
HOW MUCH WILL IT COST TO RENEW?
You can expect the cost to be similar to the former cost of upgrading. Note, this isn't a subscription, there won't be an automatic recharge, you will make a choice as usual about whether to upgrade your copy and extend the Update Service for another 365 days.
The former cost of upgrading has been 89 euros for years. So, could you please inform us?
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Thanks Boy
Yes civil it should be and a +1 is enough to make the point
Hans
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
+1
I paid 119€ to renew but probably won't do it again.
But the problem that is more important to me is that I didn't get a new key, and as far a I know I will not be able to install two different 365 versions on one machine.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
+1
Agonizing over whether to subscribe/upgrade or not, but can't see a compelling reason to do so. Main 'improvement' for me over the past year was breaking cutting and pasting text into Xara Pro from word processors (caused me all sorts of problems!). I've found a workaround, and like Xara Pro, but the renewal price is too high. I'm still not sure what to do, but prefer the old upgrade model to this one.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
+1
I have been using Xara products since 2003, however, my subscription is due in a few days and I will not be renewing.
It has been saddening to watch my preferred vector app, I am a web designer primarily and Xara was brilliant for managing my design wireframes and layouts, be easily surpassed by industry standard and relatively new apps due to changes, or, lack of UX awareness which has resulted in an increasingly frustrating experience.
Very sad :(
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
+ .5
My feeling, and I have expressed this to Xara, is that the program has gotten old and new features are added as patches because every new feature has to work with the existing code, which as I just said is getting a bit long in the tooth.
I think Xara needs to look seriously at the feature requests, and then do some serious thinking about where to go from here.
Features have been added year after year that once added are forgotten. A good example is the Bitmap Tracer. When was the last time you saw any change there. Or the Bevel Tool, the 3D Extrude, the Mold Tool, etc. To be fair some tools have been improved but many have just been forgotten.
My hope is that Xara will do some serious analysis on this venerable application, and come up with a concept for what the ideal program for the next 10 years and then start from scratch and design a program that will lead the pack as they have done in the past. This will take time and is not something that can be done overnight. But it is a place to start.
The subscription method is something that is being done in the industry, not just Xara Magix so we can't blame Xara Magix for that. What I would like to see is two powerhouse programs that work together but are separate applications, Designer X and Web Designer.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Gary, we're addressing the upgrade/renewal price (look at posts #1 and #4) that seems to be not commensurate with Xara's own update policy (see post #4 and http://www.xara.com/us/update-service).
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
The lack of new features is also an issue and spoken of that many times.
My initial concern is the renewal price with nothing to show for.
Why this price increase and the lack of information about it.
Hans
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Oh and may XARA ltd. pitch in,as they are all lurking around and like always don't comment.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
-1 Well if you're coming from a pure artist/drawing point of view I could understand. But for all others, and maybe even you, good luck with your alternatives. Not too many place to go.
Have fun with Adobe CC and Corel Graphics Suite. Watch how they chip chip chip away at your wallet... you'll be thinking "hey Xara wasn't so bad after all". The grass is not always greener ya know.
And the freebies with their user interfaces... (all non-standard or different or quirky in their own rights) will have you saying some of the same that was said about Xara.
Believe me, I'm not disputing your concerns, I agree with many on some points. But I've yet to see an app, especially these days with the new subscription model and bugs, and upgraded policies that the users
sound exactly like what going on here. If I'm wrong, please advise as to where the things I've mention do not exist or occur.
Just my 'civil' opinion.
Cliff
Oh, I forgot..... my bottom line feeling about ALL these software companies is.... that they've got us by the meatballs.... and there's nothing we can do.... at least for now....
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
@cmpan1
You can use any tool you like and many of us here do.
There are so many other software tools that do the same for less and even for free.
But if xara increases the pricing and doesn't have the courtesy to inform us.
I feel I have the right to ask why,don't you agree?
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
https://www.talkgraphics.com/showthr...166#post578166
Sorry but this is never mentioned to anyone before renewal date and it is stated that pricing would be the same at renewal date.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Before you get all defensive like always,show us the future of XARA
Or else shutdown TG, if you think it's just full of people with to much time on their hands and complaining a lot.
Take care of business like magix wants,making software for the masses and the dummies and don't relate to them anymore.
Just like Adobe does but that's a place you'll never reach.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
haakoo
@cmpan1
You can use any tool you like and many of us here do.
Yes, of course, why not? Who would/could challenge that? Of course.
Quote:
There are so many other software tools that do the same for less and even for free.
So if that's the case, would it not be a simple matter of 'just using THEM', and save oneself the stress of the debate?
If I knew of "so many other tools that do the same for less", I would just dump Xara and make the move.
It seems you have the answer to your gripe with Xara.... why would you begin this thread??? If I were you, I would
have just said my goodbye's and said "I found a better, or equal to", and proceeded.
Quote:
But if xara increases the pricing and doesn't have the courtesy to inform us.
I feel I have the right to ask why,don't you agree?
Yes, of course I agree that you have the right to ask. As I said in my previous reply, I agree with many of the +1er's concerns.
haakoo.... when I'm unhappy with 'something', and there's an alternative to which you stated, it just seems to me that a discussion/debate
may have began for the sake of having one; which I guess is ok also. But why not just go to the "other software tools that do the same for less and even for free?"
I have just not found that "other tool" that you speak of..... 'for me'.
best of luck
Cliff
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gwpriester
+ .5
My feeling, and I have expressed this to Xara, is that the program has gotten old and new features are added as patches because every new feature has to work with the existing code, which as I just said is getting a bit long in the tooth.
I think Xara needs to look seriously at the feature requests, and then do some serious thinking about where to go from here.
Features have been added year after year that once added are forgotten. A good example is the Bitmap Tracer. When was the last time you saw any change there. Or the Bevel Tool, the 3D Extrude, the Mold Tool, etc. To be fair some tools have been improved but many have just been forgotten.
My hope is that Xara will do some serious analysis on this venerable application, and come up with a concept for what the ideal program for the next 10 years and then start from scratch and design a program that will lead the pack as they have done in the past. This will take time and is not something that can be done overnight. But it is a place to start.
The subscription method is something that is being done in the industry, not just Xara Magix so we can't blame Xara Magix for that. What I would like to see is two powerhouse programs that work together but are separate applications, Designer X and Web Designer.
Very well put. You must be a mind reader - these are my thoughts exactly.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gwpriester
+ .5
My feeling, and I have expressed this to Xara, is that the program has gotten old and new features are added as patches because every new feature has to work with the existing code, which as I just said is getting a bit long in the tooth.
I think Xara needs to look seriously at the feature requests, and then do some serious thinking about where to go from here.
Features have been added year after year that once added are forgotten. A good example is the Bitmap Tracer. When was the last time you saw any change there. Or the Bevel Tool, the 3D Extrude, the Mold Tool, etc. To be fair some tools have been improved but many have just been forgotten.
My hope is that Xara will do some serious analysis on this venerable application, and come up with a concept for what the ideal program for the next 10 years and then start from scratch and design a program that will lead the pack as they have done in the past. This will take time and is not something that can be done overnight. But it is a place to start.
The subscription method is something that is being done in the industry, not just Xara Magix so we can't blame Xara Magix for that. What I would like to see is two powerhouse programs that work together but are separate applications, Designer X and Web Designer.
Hit the nail right on the head.
The vector tool is being compromised for the sake of feature rich, which is not a good goal. I recently purchased the Affinity pairing as they do work together and provide a solid alternative while maintaining clear functional specifications. Xara Designer Pro was a brilliant application but this thing they have turned it into is bloated with features I never use and some that I would use if they weren't so terrible to access.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
People, please keep this discussion civil and your comments productive and focused. Thanks.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
haakoo
Or else shutdown TG, if you think it's just full of people with to much time on their hands and complaining a lot.
They are going to, as it happened with XaraXone.
+1 that increasing the price is a dirty marketing tactic, which is a shame that Xara applies.
Anyway I like (got my money again so love) Xara Designer Pro, confirming that comparing to other companies the above mentioned "hey Xara wasn't so bad after all" is true
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Haakoo, +1. What I will be p!$$ed off about is if the current version "calls home" and is deactivated. Or if you deactivate your "non-subscribed" version and can't reactivate on either the same pc or another. I certainly don't feel that I received "what I paid for" on 365. All I want is vector graphics - DONE RIGHT - without the unnecessary web crap. Oh well....
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
I have downgraded to P&GD because I haven't once used the Web Design part of the program, due to there being a host of better website software out there.
Furthermore, P&GD is only £25 per year to continue getting the updates versus £99 for DP.
I would love Xara to bring out a cut down program that just concentrates on the vector and drawing side of things.
Their pricing structure will only encourage people to use cracked versions of the software. It's not difficult to find them online.
I have been a user since Xtreme 3 and am disappointed with the way it has gone.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
So far as the pricing goes, the cost of all Designer Pro upgrades was increased last September, 2016, after discussions with Magix. Before that the price had indeed been the same for many years, and therein lies the problem - since the cost of producing continuous updates to features and content, in multiple languages and more frequently than before, has not remained the same. So the price for renewing your Update Service after expiry is the same as upgrades to 365 since last September, although there is a discount for upgrades before expiry. You can see details for pre-expiry here
http://www.xara.com/expiring/designer-pro/ and post-expiry here
http://www.xara.com/expired/designer-pro/. Update Service renewals for Photo & Graphic Designer and Web Designer Premium currently remain the same cost as upgrades at the launch of 365 last year.
I don't have an issue with the perpetual license persé.
You should have been honest, upfront ,with the "new" renewal pricing.
It's a simple business rule;
Any provider wether for my phone or internet or gas or electra will do this, why didn't you??
They wil explain why this is and what I will get for it.
And they also inform you if there are any changes in the conditions,
like you changed the update model from 30 days after the introduction of a new version to a two week upgrade period at discount pricing before renewal date.
Others would make me aware of this by adressing me personnally or on any platform they own and not with a popup which only stated " don't forget to renew"
That's how real businesses operate and communicate.
The problem with Xara is,it cannot communicate,
Besides plastic fantastic marketing techniques.
We did communicate,but got no answers, in the dear Xara or the many other threads.
You simply didn't communi"kate"
Hans
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
cmpan1
Well if you're coming from a pure artist/drawing point of view I could understand...
I'm thinking that applies to most who have contributed to this thread so far..?
Gary made good points :-bd
...and if you want to look at drawing progams that fit the bill and have been rewritten from the ground up, look at Serif Affinity Designer and Photo - no they won't do everything xara designer does, but they are sensibly priced, roadmapped, and will of course do some things xara designer can't; grass is never greener, just a different shade; I never do all my shopping in just one store, I never do all my drawing in just one program...
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
+1 and a few more
Couldn't agree more, and I've been using Xara products, and upgraded virtually all every year, since Corel Xara in the 90's. I have just upgraded this version, but ONLY because I have invested a bit of time recently in a few webs on the platform. Next time it won't be happening...I expect patches and fixes to happen as a matter of course, not to be paid for anyway, and if I'm to pay a full 33% more than the last few upgrades, and not sure it is even this yet as my receipt said £139 but the offer was £99.
When even the sainted ;-) G W Preister complains and agrees, then SOMETHING is wrong!
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
"grass is never greener, just a different shade" - nice, Steve.:salute:
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
+1 Xara was nice while it lasted...
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
XD365 a fantastic program, but it always lacked something compared to the top in the industry(though she always had that didn't have other). And that's why I really would like to see a roadmap from manufacturers. Use and will use but very hard to pay for subscription do not even understand in which direction the development.
If will not develop vector tools(!) for graphics, it will be a sad(.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
I call it "subscription"(although in xara do not think so), because I pay 130$ and wait ... wait .... and i don`t know what i get ... maybe the best software update, and maybe nothing interesting)).
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
iamtheblues
"grass is never greener, just a different shade" - nice, Steve.:salute:
the irony is bob, that grass only appears green because that is the one wavelength in the visible spectrum that grass cannot absorb, it is reflected; so you could argue that the one thing grass itself is not is green
it's all smoke and mirrors - bit like xara's marketing spiel...;))
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
maksimon
XD365 a fantastic program, but it always lacked something compared to the top in the industry(though she always had that didn't have other). And that's why I really would like to see a roadmap from manufacturers. Use and will use but very hard to pay for subscription do not even understand in which direction the development.
If will not develop vector tools(!) for graphics, it will be a sad(.
+1. A roadmap would be very welcome.
I must admit that this thread has me a bit dismayed. I've chosen xara as my preferred tool in breaking away from the adobe cc and am starting to wonder if I made the right choice. I picked up serif affinity designer as well, since it is so cheap, and have worked with it a bit as an alternative. At least with respect to drawing, I like the feel of xara better. Overall, they're both great tools, but I prefer Xara and it is a more mature and full-featured program at this point. But I've used xara long enough to understand the criticism. For now I'll take a wait and see approach, use both, and hope that I can settle on one sooner than later.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Nice and Civil and on topic.....
I've just been reminded my Designer pro is now out of cover. The web linked page is asking me for £139. Is this an error? Last years update was £75.00 This is an increase of 85%.
Also we have had our activation count reduced to 2. 3 was great and nobody wants to pratt about registering and deregistering software.
This is 56% more expensive than Office 365 which has 5 activation's plus 1 tablet and 1 phone for nowt, and 32% more than the Photoshop/Lightroom combo
Given that your subscription money is payment in advance for the prospect of services rendered, rolling a re-install back to the subscription date is taking away what we paid for in the first place.
Proshow have got round this and link you to the last version before your free updates expired. This is fair
Given that upgrade paths help to stem piracy and develop loyal high lifetime value customers the price needs to around the same as the old upgrade system which was traditionally about 25% of the full new price.
Photoshop CC is actually a lot cheaper than the 2 yearly updates were, and Office around the same price as the previous upgrades.
Also something needs to be done for senior citizens who wish to remain active after retirement but cannot run to several subscriptions eating away the pension.
So is this £139 a mistake or what?
Bob,
Since Webstyle 2.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
bobmurden
So is this £139 a mistake or what?
Bob,
Since Webstyle 2.
No mistake, Bob, of that you can be quite sure. It is greed, no more, no less.
You would be better off getting to grips with Affinity Designer and steer clear of the mess that is Xara/Magix.
Bob.
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
To bad that none of the regular members reacted when they're being pulled one over.
Only the same seem to resist injustice.
Yes I did express deliberately the word injustice and that is a word everybody seems to be full about nowadays but don't seem to grasp to its full extent.
Resistance starts with the small things and the way people here go about things is like this.
We screw you
You may rant about it
We explain ourselves but give nothing or no real answers
We give our moderators instructions to let us rant a bit more.
We give our moderators instructions to close the thread.
Done deal go back to business as usual and show them the finger
I think this is real mature behavior from a so called company.
[as they said in the transcription of the Nixon Tapes - EXPLETIVE DELETED]
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
haakoo
To bad that none of the regular members reacted when they're being pulled one over.
Only the same seem to resist injustice.
Yes I did express deliberately the word injustice and that is a word everybody seems to be full about nowadays but don't seem to grasp to its full extent.
Resistance starts with the small things and the way people here go about things is like this.
We screw you
You may rant about it
We explain ourselves but give nothing or no real answers
We give our moderators instructions to let us rant a bit more.
We give our moderators instructions to close the thread.
Done deal go back to business as usual and show them the finger
I think this is real mature behavior from a so called company.
[as they said in the transcription of the Nixon Tapes - EXPLETIVE DELETED]
haakoo, I am not in anyone's pocket.
I have been a questioning thorn in the side of Xara from the first suggestion of the support model.
No instructions have come from anywhere to allow ranting to continue - I will block a rant or at least try to redirect the conversation.
I have just argued to keep a Thread open and that is yielding some insights.
Xara's direction appears to be driven by Magix but their corporate agreements are not in my scrutiny.
Raise you concern.
Accept the response as Xara's position.
Use logic to try and persuade a change of direction.
Place a single concept at a time in the Dear Xara... section.
Acorn
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Re: At least give us a kiss(goodbye)
Fortunately I can afford any upgrade, but out of principle, I am now an Affinity customer. I'll keep the 10, 11 and 365 of Xara, but that's me. Unless they deactivate (illegally) my current version, I'll just use what I have and be done with any further Xara product. I do believe it a capable and useful tool, but throwing good money at "something", that doesn't care about our concerns, really hurts. Fool me once, shame on me, fool me twice... NOT.