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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Doug
One cigar for Berklee! :-)
Magic Samplitude and Sequoia are some of the highest priced digital recording studio software out there. More or less in the same price range as Cubase SX, Nuendo, Logic, etc.
Coming soon-the $700 Xtreme Pro Super Deluxe XL! :rolleyes:
Xara Super Deluxe Mega Xtreme Radical To The Max XXXL? (MSRP : $1250) :)
This of course won't count the Limited Edition version, which will ship in a steel box with custom artwork on it for another 350 bucks.
Well, there's the path, it's clearly laid out. Sad.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
I think Bill (Soquilli) is on the take, how else would he get that fancy Batman mask. :o
Well, Beans...I found an error last night and now I can't find where I wrote it down. :(
It was in Flash...
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
James the mask is so I can review my posts for errors without having to see myself :eek:
How much can a few black shapes and a few white shapes with feathering and transparency cost ;)
I wanted a batman mask and cape since 1951 and finally got them :D
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
A very interesting document, thank you remi.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
berklee
Xara Super Deluxe Mega Xtreme Radical To The Max XXXL? (MSRP : $1250) :)
This of course won't count the Limited Edition version, which will ship in a steel box with custom artwork on it for another 350 bucks.
Well, there's the path, it's clearly laid out. Sad.
I'd laugh but it's too sad.
BTW-You might want to do a Google search for Vector Graphics Software. It's about time to do so-
'Nuff said. ;)
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
wall
A very interesting document, thank you remi.
Very interesting indeed. Mission statement from the horse's mouth so to speak.
Thanks very much Remi for setting the record straight.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Remi,
Thanks for that - well spotted. Looks like my Adobe Studio upgrade might start to look cheap.. :-(
Sigh.
Paul
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
pauland
Looks like my Adobe Studio upgrade might start to look cheap..
I doubt it would look 'cheap.' Notice the 'goodwill' listed in the assets of the Xara purchase. That means that happy customers are important to the beancounters at Magix. I am suspecting that they might increase XXP's price to about $400~$500 eventually, to undercut Adobe, while having a superior product. Someone figures 'goodwill' is worth something, and if they took the time to quantify it (although it is truly unquantifiable), they probably won't want to lose it, so they will probably have a couple price points, with a 'good' version available more cheaply than the pro.
Having said that, I don't know if I will ever upgrade again, as XXP does what I want it to. But if they came out with something killer, such as brushes that were variable width outline due to pen pressure, I'd certainly consider it.
Best wishes (even to Magix),
David
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
David O'Neil
I am suspecting that they might increase XXP's price to about $400~$500 eventually, to undercut Adobe, while having a superior product.
I don't want to get into specifics, but they have a vector art package that is 299...
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
I have a question:
Will we see some major enhancement being added to Pro in some subsequent point updates? Seriously, the difference between "pro" and "standard" Xara is really small now. Can these features alone really justify $170 difference?
Xara3D 6 included
PDF/X export
RAW photo import
XPS support
Color separation support
PANTONE® color support
Levels XPE plug-in
Multi-page documents
Short cut key configuration
Most of other softwares that have an LE version usually limit the features heavily to justify the price difference for the full version. Xara Pro is one of a kind in this practice as far as I can see.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
wall
I have a question:
Will we see some major enhancement being added to Pro in some subsequent point updates? Seriously, the difference between "pro" and "standard" Xara is really small now. Can these features alone really justify $170 difference?
Xara3D 6 included
PDF/X export
RAW photo import
XPS support
Color separation support
PANTONE® color support
Levels XPE plug-in
Multi-page documents
Short cut key configuration
Most of other softwares that have an LE version usually limit the features heavily to justify the price difference for the full version. Xara Pro is one of a kind in this practice as far as I can see.
A good point to raise - I'd be very interested in reading responses to this question.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Just read all this thread and looked at the improvements on the link pasted way back http://www.xara.com/products/xtreme/whatsnew.asp
I cant really see why one would want to gripe too much about the cost of the upgrade. Not sure what is expected from a 'point upgrade' compared to a 'new upgrade'.
Reference was made to not paying for Win SP upgrades - were these really not much more than bux fixes and security fixes?
I have seen arguments like this on other graphics threads but my question is why we grumble at small prices of upgrades that perhaps equate to a good night out at the boozer with mates or an evening wining and dining the girlfriend or wife, or a weeks supply of fags!!
I don't mind supporting a program if I get benefit from it. Perhaps these small amounts for upgrade might speed up development of this program that in one breath many expouse the virtues of, whilst the other hand gives it the stick.
My observations from the other half of the globe.
regards, Richard
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
wall
I have a question:
Will we see some major enhancement being added to Pro in some subsequent point updates? Seriously, the difference between "pro" and "standard" Xara is really small now. Can these features alone really justify $170 difference?
Xara3D 6 included
I already have that, no refund for old xara3d6 users, maybe I can give
my current version to my brother, but how will he be able to register it, when it is registered to me?
Quote:
PDF/X export
RAW photo import
XPS support
Color separation support
Maybe handy in the future.
Quote:
PANTONE® color support
Through Xara X1 I already had pantone colors.
Did I pay twice for it now?
Quote:
Levels XPE plug-in
Multi-page documents
Short cut key configuration
Yep might be handy in the future.
Quote:
Most of other softwares that have an LE version usually limit the features heavily to justify the price difference for the full version. Xara Pro is one of a kind in this practice as far as I can see.
Hmm I didn`t see flash in your list, does flash now also come
with xara xtreme?
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Richard S
Just read all this thread and looked at the improvements on the link pasted way back
http://www.xara.com/products/xtreme/whatsnew.asp
I cant really see why one would want to gripe too much about the cost of the upgrade. Not sure what is expected from a 'point upgrade' compared to a 'new upgrade'.
Reference was made to not paying for Win SP upgrades - were these really not much more than bux fixes and security fixes?
I have seen arguments like this on other graphics threads but my question is why we grumble at small prices of upgrades that perhaps equate to a good night out at the boozer with mates or an evening wining and dining the girlfriend or wife, or a weeks supply of fags!!
I don't mind supporting a program if I get benefit from it. Perhaps these small amounts for upgrade might speed up development of this program that in one breath many expouse the virtues of, whilst the other hand gives it the stick.
My observations from the other half of the globe.
regards, Richard
The problem is that these small cost "upgrades" are everywhere.
So not much money left anymore for a night on the town, or a couple
of packages of fags. So to you it might be small, but for some it is getting big.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
I guess we have different views on what's a "small amount" for an upgrade (+ add VAT and shipping...)
Quote:
I have seen arguments like this on other graphics threads but my question is why we grumble at small prices of upgrades that perhaps equate to a good night out at the boozer with mates or an evening wining and dining the girlfriend or wife, or a weeks supply of fags!!
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
wall
I have a question:
Will we see some major enhancement being added to Pro in some subsequent point updates? Seriously, the difference between "pro" and "standard" Xara is really small now. Can these features alone really justify $170 difference?
Xara3D 6 included
PDF/X export
RAW photo import
XPS support
Color separation support
PANTONE® color support
Levels XPE plug-in
Multi-page documents
Short cut key configuration
Most of other softwares that have an LE version usually limit the features heavily to justify the price difference for the full version. Xara Pro is one of a kind in this practice as far as I can see.
Well to look at the question in a different way: you can think of Pro as being excellent value for money (compared to MS or Adobe equivalents). You can then look at Xtreme standard as sensational value for money - only slightly fewer features not required by everyone - at an insanely low price. Is it really right to demand justification for the price difference? Look from top down (relative to the competition) rather than bottom up (relative to everything being free). Do Adobe or MS even offer 'lite' versions of their 'professional' products at such an incredibly good price?
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
No doubt in my mind that xara is exceptional value for money.
However, if there are genuine bug fixes available, and the only way to get them is to upgrade - thats a genuine grievance in my book for those who need the bug fixes only.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
handrawn
No doubt in my mind that xara is exceptional value for money.
However, if there are genuine bug fixes available, and the only way to get them is to upgrade - thats a genuine grievance in my book for those who need the bug fixes only.
Exactly, and since bug fixes are essentially 'mistakes' in the program that should not be there in the first place, point upgrades are usually 'corrections' to the software. Why should users pay more for the developers mistakes and malfunctions?
The worth of new features depend on the individual's opinion of them-is it worth it to me?
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Well, lets take this and discuss it. This may be a 'point' upgrade, but it actually adds significant new features that were not present in 3.0. It is therefore not feasible to give it away for free.
It was also recently brought to my attention that neither Microsoft nor Adobe give bug fixed versions away for free.
Illustrator has significant numbers of known bugs that Adobe will not fix - some which can reliably crash the final releases of software.
There is always scope in complex software for bugs to exist, but Xara has considerably fewer bugs than the competition.
And another point people are missing: Xara do give bug fixes away for free; minor updates that are released after a major release address the serious bugs found. Clear evidence of this from Xara is the release of 3.2.1 just days after 3.2.
These points invalidate any arguments that are being made here that Xara is not taking bugs seriously and is making you pay for upgrades to address them.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Xhris
Well, lets take this and discuss it. This may be a 'point' upgrade, but it actually adds significant new features that were not present in 3.0. It is therefore not feasible to give it away for free.
It was also recently brought to my attention that neither Microsoft nor Adobe give bug fixed versions away for free.
Illustrator has significant numbers of known bugs that Adobe will not fix - some which can reliably crash the final releases of software.
There is always scope in complex software for bugs to exist, but Xara has considerably fewer bugs than the competition.
And another point people are missing: Xara do give bug fixes away for free; minor updates that are released after a major release address the serious bugs found. Clear evidence of this from Xara is the release of 3.2.1 just days after 3.2.
These points invalidate any arguments that are being made here that Xara is not taking bugs seriously and is making you pay for upgrades to address them.
Question then:
either
a) there are no bug fixes for 3.0 in 3.2
b) there are bug fixes, but they are available separately for those who don't need to upgrade for the features [which of course will need to be paid for]
c) there are bugs fixes, but tough you have to upgrade to get them
which is is please? :)
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Xhris
Well, lets take this and discuss it. This may be a 'point' upgrade, but it actually adds significant new features that were not present in 3.0. It is therefore not feasible to give it away for free.
It was also recently brought to my attention that neither Microsoft nor Adobe give bug fixed versions away for free.
Illustrator has significant numbers of known bugs that Adobe will not fix - some which can reliably crash the final releases of software.
There is always scope in complex software for bugs to exist, but Xara has considerably fewer bugs than the competition.
And another point people are missing: Xara do give bug fixes away for free; minor updates that are released after a major release address the serious bugs found. Clear evidence of this from Xara is the release of 3.2.1 just days after 3.2.
These points invalidate any arguments that are being made here that Xara is not taking bugs seriously and is making you pay for upgrades to address them.
In your opinion. Some new features, yes. Signifigant? To you maybe. If the release was really that good, Xara would be the first to call it version 4-a full SIGNIFIGANT upgrade.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
handrawn
Question then...
I'm sure there are fixes for issues in 3.0 in 3.21. To state things from a coders perspective: I'm pretty sure that it's not technically feasible to release bug fixes separately, as the code that has to be changed to fix the bugs might overlap with code that implements new features. Even if there are no direct overlaps, it's likely that features and bug fixes can affect each other indirectly through other layers of code.
It would take a monumental effort (away from generally advancing the product) to separate bug fixes from each other or from new features, and then test all those different versions and keep patch downloads up to date.
Do MS or Adobe release separate compilation bug fixes like this for free for their vector software? Or are they only available when you buy a new version (i.e. one with new features)
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Doug
In your opinion. Some new features, yes. Signifigant? To you maybe. If the release was really that good, Xara would be the first to call it version 4-a full SIGNIFIGANT upgrade.
New features are observed fact. Xara released 3.2 with it's customers in mind. As they explained: they released 3.2 because it contained features that were implemented in the release of the Magix version, and Xara wanted the Xara users to have access to them as well now, seeing as they were done. Thus Xara users could have the latest greatest version. There were new features, so it can't be given away for free. Coincidentally, bugs in complex overlapping code were fixed as always during the product life cycle. I really can't see the justification anymore for complaints about bug fixes given what's been said in my last two posts.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Xhris
I'm sure there are fixes for issues in 3.0 in 3.21. To state things from a coders perspective: I'm pretty sure that it's not technically feasible to release bug fixes separately, as the code that has to be changed to fix the bugs might overlap with code that implements new features. Even if there are no direct overlaps, it's likely that features and bug fixes can affect each other indirectly through other layers of code.
It would take a monumental effort (away from generally advancing the product) to separate bug fixes from each other or from new features, and then test all those different versions and keep patch downloads up to date.
Do MS or Adobe release separate compilation bug fixes like this for free for their vector software? Or are they only available when you buy a new version (i.e. one with new features)
Yes I hear what you say, and actually I understand this.
And I am happy with the upgrade myself.
But you can appreciate the disgruntlement of those who need bug fixes but not the features?
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
handrawn
But you can appreciate the disgruntlement of those who need bug fixes but not the features?
Yes, and I'm one of them. But it's a complete misdirection of voice to complain in the manner being done so here given the unique release situation. I've just been trying to provide some understanding. I'm sure with the next big release, there will not only be big new features, but yet more bugs fixed in the ever evolving code - most likely the old ones people bark about the most, and new ones introduced by the new features.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Xhris
My opinions are not present here.
Right-because you mistake your opinions for some universal truth.
Whatever! :rolleyes:
Have a real nice day now Bye-bye!
ROTFLMAO!!!
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Xhris
t was also recently brought to my attention that neither Microsoft nor Adobe give bug fixed versions away for free.
Err.. Microsoft and Adobe supply free upgrades to their software at various times.
Well just about all software has bugs, so nobody supplies bug fixed versions..
Paul
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
pauland
Err.. Microsoft and Adobe supply free upgrades to their software at various times.
Well just about all software has bugs, so nobody supplies bug fixed versions..
Paul
MS has money to burn, and does Adobe give free upgrades away to free software, or paid software? I get free updates to the free acrobat reader. I'd be surprised if Adobe or MS gave away free upgrades to their graphics software that competes with Xara.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Xhris
I'd be surprised if Adobe or MS gave away free upgrades to their graphics software that competes with Xara.
Well, be surprised then. All of the Adobe software I've purchased have had free updates (updaters) during their lifetimes. MS regularly supplies updates (service packs) to their OS software and also MS office. I don't own any other MS graphics products (besides VISIO).
Most companies freeze the software once they release a 'significant' (whatever that is) update that requires the user to pay. One fantastic exception to this has been Newtek (www.newtek.com) that doesn't currently charge for point releases even though they often include significant functionality enhancement.
None of this is a dig at Xara BTW, just refuting your statement that free upgrades/updates don't exist from Adobe/MS.
Paul
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Quote:
Originally Posted by
pauland
Well, be surprised then. All of the Adobe software I've purchased have had free updates (updaters) during their lifetimes. MS regularly supplies updates (service packs) to their OS software and also MS office. I don't own any other MS graphics products (besides VISIO).
Most companies freeze the software once they release a 'significant' (whatever that is) update that requires the user to pay. One fantastic exception to this has been Newtek (
www.newtek.com) that doesn't currently charge for point releases even though they often include significant functionality enhancement.
None of this is a dig at Xara BTW, just refuting your statement that free upgrades/updates don't exist from Adobe/MS.
Paul
Hi Paul. Oh yeah, I know MS and Adobe give free updates away to some software. But I wasn't sure it was given away for their vector graphics software. Is it - I'm not sure? And if so, it is analogous to Xara releasing 3.2.1 after 3.2, or is it analogous to releasing 3.2 for free to 3.0 - i.e. giving new features away? I suspect they don't give anything new away for free. The criticisms have come about because it was +0.2; it may only be 3.2, but it was a frozen release with significant-enough new features that came about due to unique circumstances (the new Magix release). This of course doesn't mean I don't want bug fixes. :) Anyway, that's all that can probably be said really without repeating things.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
'My name is Sahra X, king of kings:
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!'
:D
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EMF import and the equation editor
Hi,
I do not want to mess with my Xara installation by installing the trial over my actual version. One thing that could push me to upgrade would be the possibility of importing equations from MS equation editor into XaraX. We had some discussion about this in the past but I was wandering if the new EMF import feature has solved this problem. Does anyone of you tested this with the new version? If you have, I would be very grateful to you to reporting it here.
Best regards,
Murat
PS. I use other software for importing and exporting and filters by Xara seems quite unreliable to me. They should really reconstruct them in order to keep up with the competition (even if they are much more able for simply doing complex effects).
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Re: EMF import and the equation editor
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
I do not think so, since it is about a new functionality of the new version (EMF import). Moreover its is related to my decision to upgrade or not and it seems to me that many discussions in this thread are about the same decision...
Murat
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Hi yildi, I was referring to my post, not yours. :)
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
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Re: EMF import and the equation editor
Quote:
Originally Posted by
yildi
Hi,
I do not want to mess with my Xara installation by installing the trial over my actual version. One thing that could push me to upgrade would be the possibility of importing equations from MS equation editor into XaraX. We had some discussion about this in the past but I was wandering if the new EMF import feature has solved this problem. Does anyone of you tested this with the new version? If you have, I would be very grateful to you to reporting it here.
Best regards,
Murat
PS. I use other software for importing and exporting and filters by Xara seems quite unreliable to me. They should really reconstruct them in order to keep up with the competition (even if they are much more able for simply doing complex effects).
This is something I've experienced directly. I have a Math Type equation in Word which I wanted to paste into Xara. Apparently they have new EMF/WMF filters which allow this in 3.2.1. I came across an example which didn't work though, and submitted it to them. I think they are working to make sure you can paste equations like you ask for the final CD release. If I hear anything (and remember), I'll let you know.
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Thank you very much for this feedback Xhris!
Best regards,
Murat
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
One thing I am wondering about.
Did Xtreme cost $79 when I bought it? It still costs $79, so what are the upgraders from Xtreme 3.2 paying for? The PRO version has gone up in price
just about what Xara3D6 would cost, if they bought it seperately.
(I did, now I have two, why would I need two?)
So the upgrade price I payed is now also visible in the purchase price.
But what about Xtreme? It seems the same price as before? Did the upgraders
get any new features? o my concklusion must be that most of the changes
are in PRO. The xara3D6 is not a new feature, but I have to pay for it.
Not such a big deal for me, if I would be able to pass my old version of
xara3d6 on to my brother and he could register that one, but that is just for me. I am a bit puzzled how these up pricing works???
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Well I have all the Xara products including Xara Xtreme. I thought I would check to see what an upgrade to Pro would cost me. Xara say's it's $170!
Well, not to gripe, but why? I'm not really interested at that price. I probably would have bitten for $60 or $70, but not $170. Why so much for us long time Xara product users? I can upgrade Illustrator for $199 or my whole CS2 suite for $399. And I don't need another copy of X3D.
I guess I now have to choose. :(
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Re: Xtreme Pro 3.2 & Xtreme 3.2 Released!
Red what version are you currently using or the most recent version or upgrade you purchased? Did you use the Upgrade/Discounts button on the Purchase page?