Adobe vs Alternatives

[LogoMount]

I would really recommend you to get Xara, it has quite a good potential! (it's like a nice combination of Illustrator and Photoshop) What is really better in Xara comparing to Adobe is that it's more intuitive and you don't have to remember all these key combinations to work. It works nice with .eps - even there are some slightly different colors in print-simulation. But if you're using .psd more often the only con is that it's impossible to export the work like smart objects, but still it handles photoshop files good. But since most of the graphics is made in .eps 8.0 that shouldn't be much of a problem. Talking about Corel, I've downloaded a trial recently and it was unreally buggy, slow and crashing without saving the file - so Xara looks a nice choice.

[Albacore]

I would have thought this thread is finished and could be closed. I don't mind standing up for Adobe if anyone wants to stay on topic.

[MyCoalescen]

That is all good info. Xara is still a contender to adobe for sure. They are on my top 3 list because they can port AI/PSD which goes a long way in my book. I need to try their trials. I like their web site as it gives real information about the products wow what a thing. Adobes does not give you much information easily. They expect that they need no introduction and few specs on their products. Corel was also nice for giving helpful information. Both corel and xara give a good amount of tips/tricks and written/video tutorials and its only serif with very few. Xara and Corel both look much more intuitive than adobe. Serif seems like a cheaper clone of adobe. Their layout are very similar and they work much the same but just more limited. I wonder how long you used corel for with the problems coming up. I use Imacs at school and even they can be slightly buggy. I probably crash them about once a week with adobe products. I make them near freeze a few times a week and freeze every few weeks. So even an up to date dedicated not bogged down computer can still have issues. I mostly blame the software if it manages to crash a 1500$ computer. Waiting for my copy of paint-shop ultimate in the mail. It was and still is 1/2 off making it hard to go wrong with. If I love it great if now only out 50$ and can always sell on ebay for 50$ hehe or give to my sisters in high school. Serif just seems like a baby adobe clone and seems to have a much smaller following than xara or corel. I posted this same thread and it took a few days for any one to post on it. I have been doing this same thread in adobe, corel, xara and serif.

The biggest problem ive been hearing about xara is lack of full open type support. Im a graphic designer and that is almost a deal breaker for me. Any thoughts?

How is xara on customer service? Adobe is very bad and would be hard to make worse. Ive contacted Corel 2 times and the service we very quick and good. Waited less than 1 minutes for online chat.

Xaras claim to fame is being the fastest real contender company to adobe. Any experience with this? They also claim to have much smaller programs and file sizes which Im sure helps.

In other news adobe has a class action law suite started against it. It is because of the hacked and leaked account information. The plaintiff claims they were false advertising them selves as having market leading security. The class of people are the 150 million people with compromised account information. They also bring up that adobe does not and is not allowing a way out of the CC (crazy cloud) without monetary lose. The plaintiff is also demanding that adobe allow those with effected CC account be allowed to cancel their subscription with out penalty. They also want to charge adobe with the legal fees! This means adobes 5 billion in revenue wont completely automatically win this for them as the plaintiff can spend as much as they want as long as they win and have adobe pay it. Im sure adobe will win because of money and backing but what if they dont win? What if adobe is worried and does a settlement instead? What if this just opened the flood gates and others will start law suites against adobe? What if people also start an anti trust law suite that adobe is a monopoly? This could be a very big set of cases. Consider that adobes 150 million compromised accounts is the largest known in US history! That is a lot of leverage to say they messed up and epically did so. This could be the Chernobyl of hacked software! Chernobyl was a problem of incompetence, greed and faulty equipment.

I do see a place for laptops, all in ones and tablets. Just like everything there is a time and place. I got new phones during summer at AT&T store. Each sales person had a tablet, a finger scanner and a shoulder worn mini printer (ive used them at work and they are nice). It was incredibly handy for them and us. They didnt have to go back and forth to the counter to look things up or have us fill things out. They just looked it up on the tablet or when we purchased just passed it to us and we filled out the form. The only time they needed to be tied to a desk was for transferring files from 1 device to an other. Such as when we traded in our phones and wanted to keep our photos and contacts.

[Albacore]

I can't get over your hatred here of Adobe, what have they done to you. I can understand people buying other software, let's say Freehand, about 10 years ago, as it had multiple artboards, better text engine and quite a few other extras over Illy. Choosing Xara 15 years ago because it was super fast, re-drew drawings in a blink, small files and software footprint and could handle transparencies. This was a time when the two big software companies, Corel & Adobe had software that was clunky, slowed down the computer to a crawl every time you moved a line and couldn't handle text. Those days are gone, we have larger H/disc now so who cares what is the size of the installed software, much more cheap memory, faster processors, 64 bit O.S. step forwards in using graphic processing power as well and all in all huge step forwards in non crashing O.S.

Now let's talk about today's vector programmes and there is only really one who have made any real step forwards in vector development and that is Illy as the other are just tinkering this year. Corel Draw:- 64 bit support, smear, attract, twist and repel, better colour swatches. Draw Plus:- 64 bit support, arc, spiral and triangle tools, optical stacking order, Pantone GOE Colour space. Xara:- 64 bit support (that's all to help produce vectors). Inkscape:- better support for SVG

It's all about the amount of money that's thrown to the development teams and the only ones that can afford it is Adobe and that is a fact of life. If you don't agree with Adobe's new licensing then buy CS6 as its stand alone, that is what I am doing and get on with life/work. All vector programmes have their positives & negatives and it is good practice to have an alternative as backup to do certain jobs. I still have Freehand on my h/disc and I occasionally still use it, but my primary tool used to be, when working, was Illy because I had to. If I had a choice in it I would have used Xara till the cows came home but I am not so sure now. Look at the tool set of each software package and make a comparison of each tool and ask yourself would you use it or not. Then do the same about the interface how you use the palette's, the colour space, the swatches and how your work is exported to the format your working in and make your mind up. The skills that you have learned up to now will give you confidence to make your own mind up.

[MarcT]

Those days are gone, we have larger H/disc now so who cares what is the size of the installed software, much more cheap memory, faster processors, 64 bit O.S. step forwards in using graphic processing power as well and all in all huge step forwards in non crashing O.S.

I still find Illustrator slow even having a fast computer. I assigned a wousewheel zoom In AI and you can see it struggling to refresh in comparison.

Marc

[Gamerprinter]

While I personally have no need to subscribe to Adobe's cloud system to access their software - I have no dependence on Adobe software (as I've explained before). That said, a friend of mine relies on Illustrator to do his sign graphic designs, then ports files over to Flexi-Sign for cutting. He does use Adobe's cloud software and he absolutely loves it. Consider that he is working on Illustrator at least twice a week, so economically the Adobe cloud service is cheap (for him.) Additionally, there are tons of other Adobe software, that he'd normally never have access to, if relying on the old system of purchasing a copy of Illustrator or other Adobe software, but with the cloud service he is using many of those other Adobe apps. So it seems to me that the OP of this thread has a concern with the change on how software is accessed for the money. It might be something that you're not used to, but that doesn't mean it's a bad thing. There are advocates for the cloud system, and under the right circumstances, I too, might see it as a good thing. The OP's hatred on the changes is unreasonable - Adobe hasn't done anything wrong here.

[pauland]

What has upset people ( really ) is that Adobe has removed the choice to discontinue payment and still have continued usage. For many design professionals that doesn't matter, but for others it does. I think that's what turned Adobe into the evil empire for many.

I understand that those on a limited income who willonly ever want to use photoshop and upgrade every X years, the subscription model is an issue. It's also an issue if you have a cash crisis and miss the subscription payment.

Anyone aspiring to break into the industry as anything but a lone ranger, needs to be conversant and comfortable with Adobe.

[Boy]

Paul, you gave a very good summary of what must be the most important reason why so many people are unhappy with Adobe's recent adoption of the subscription model. I had not really understood it so far but now realize that some of these people fear that if they cannot afford to board or stay aboard on the 'mighty ship Adobe' they are in risk of becoming professionally isolated.

Ironically enough, many of the folks who respond to the Adobe bashers' gripes confirm these people's fears when somewhere in their arguments they point out that Adobe software is the industry standard and will continue to remain so for the foreseeable future.

[MyCoalescen]

The few time over the past few years when I dared to tempt fate and try illustrators filters and 3d rendering it was always a mistake. The issue is when you make any change to how it renders it or moving then the whole thing has to be recalculated which can cause the computer to basically freeze for the next 5-15 seconds which makes small changes very painful. I like nudging objects and cant do it well with these. It easier to turn the effect off, move the object then turn it back on and hope its in about the spot you want.

I have lost most my faith in adobe. I went from loving them for 10 years and thinking it would be all I would use for the life to have the blinders taken off. Seeing them for what they really are and connecting the dots of their very bad and abusive business practices over the past 5 years. I still have a small glimmer of hope for adobe but like a 12 step program or AA the first step to change is to admit you have a problem which adobe is not really doing. My quest has lead me to realize adobe maybe king but there are aspiring princes in the creative software realm coming into adult hood and challenging old man adobe. I may still get cs6. There are 3 reasons iv come to distrust adobe. 1 is their last few years of customer abuse, 2 CCs lacking of any possible perpetual license option at all and 3 CCs pretty much giving 2 options of buy 1 or buy all. If they could do a middle buy I would be tempted. Say 30$/month for your pick of 3 programs ect.

In other news adobe has folded for the moment and allowing all for a time to get the 9.99$/month photoshop + light room + bridge for the 1st year. Things like this are what I was hoping adobe would do. Things that shows they are willing to listen to customers needs/wants. I consider this a small -> medium change. If they make a few more changes like this adobe could win my trust back which is why im giving them till june before I decide 100% my future software options.

For me and many CC is a very sudden and abrupt change. They need to nurture the next generation not alienate them. Ease us into it dont just suddenly one day cut us off. It would be as simple as offering continuing with cs for the life of cs 7 and or offering a perpetual license option. Say give us a license after x years of using cc and its locks in at that state if we cancel then have an other x years subscription lined up. Could also after x amount of time allow a buy out for x money. Then say after 2-4 cycles of that cut off allowing to get perpetual licenses at all after which people had years to ease into it.

[theinonen]

Whole point of standards should be that people could use any software they feel comfortable and work the way they like to do things, not the way some particular software forces them to do instead. I believe good software should adapt to workflow of the user and not the other way around where you have to bend yourself to work with the software.

Some companies also seem to release new versions of their software just to break compatibility with earlier versions and force people to upgrade or be left behind.