Explaining email POP3/SMTP/IMAP etc

[stlewis]

Maybe you too have been trying to understand or explain how email flows between addresses, hosting and Outlook.

See the attached XD file.

I think I have the Hotmail setup right - it is the one I am working with, and the traditional POP3/SMTP architecture on page 3 should be ok. Is the Gmail one on page 2 correct? Does an Android, iPhone or a Blackberry work the same way? I guess another picture for Microsoft Exchange is needed too.

The problem with the architecture on page three is that outgoing emails never get brought back to a single point - if you send an email from a webmail page, it never comes into Outlook. The only option is to copy emails back to yourself. And you have to be careful with deleted emails - if you delete in webmail, the deleted email never goes to the Outlook deleted items folder.

Feel free to play with the file! Any advice welcome.

Thanks.

[Big Frank]

It's interesting that you should upload that diagram. I've been intimately involved with running a hosting business for years and have always struggled with demonstrating graphically to the clients how "email" works. It is in fact a huge subject and trying to simplify it into a schematic that I can understand is easy, and Xara is the perfect tool for doing so (for me). However, illustrating it so that a novice can understand it isn't at all simple. I can see a few holes in your diagrams, not necessarily because you have made mistakes, but because you have left things out. But there just isn't enough space on such a schematic to explain the fundamental difference between, for example, POP and IMAP, differences that would have a dramatic effect on the customer's experience of his email client. And then you throw Webmail into the melting pot and you have people crying into their tea.

[stlewis]

The plea I get is: "I want to get my emails via Gmail for when I am out of the office, but then have them in Outlook when I get back". The server I look after (Linux, postfix) does not allow collection and relaying/forwarding; I don't know if this a generic rule or whether some servers allow it. And most ISPs now seem to block outgoing relayed emails - so that they are forwarded from your ISP back to a hosting server. So I need a diagram to show how this requirement can be delivered.

As far as I can make out, only Outlook 2010 has support for synching so that sent and deleted emails appear in all locations.

After a few months with my Windows Phone 7 phone and reluctantly gone the Hotmail route, it does work very seamlessly. I know it is a partly cloud-based approach (once emails get to Outlook they are off the cloud) but I am not troubled by that.

Thanks for your comments.

[ckh]

smtp used for sending mail is normally on port 25. My isp, for example blocks both ports 25 & 26 with 26 being a popular backup port. What that means is that my ISP wants me to send mail through their servers mainly for the reason of monitoring the outgoing mail for spam.

I run quite a few servers, so my solution is to have the server monitor port 27 for smtp connections along with port 25. Been doing this for years now and works well. Instead of using port 25 for smtp when I set up Outlook or Thunderbird, I use 27 and haven't had any problems at all. Gives my clients the opportunity to send mail also when their ISP blocks one or both of the other ports.

Another thing I do is set my email clients to delete the messages off of the server after something like 3 days. My phone setting is to just leave the email on the server. That way, I can use my phone or webmail to check for updates when I'm on the road and since the mail isn't deleted off of the server after retrieving it, it's on the server for the other email client to retrieve it. By having it delete it after 3 days, then the mailbox won't fill up.

I think not having the ability to add a forwarder is unusual. I have and make use of forwarders, although not to send a copy to another email address.

There is a setting in email clients regarding deleting the mail off of the server after retrieving it. In Outlook 2007:

Tools->Accounts

Select the account you wish to modify click change or double click it, then click the More Settings button. Click on the Advance tab in the Delivery section you can make the changes you need.

In Thunderbird, you would view the settings for an email account then click on the Server Settings in the Tree to the left for each email account you wish to change settings on and there is an option to Leave it on the server and for how long.

[Big Frank]

I use and encourage my clients to use port 25025 and the effect is, of course, the same as you opening port 27 for smtp and gets around some of the impositions set by many ISPs which, as can be seen here, can be easily circumvented by those running their own servers.

I'm not an Outlook user (in fact I don't think I have ever used it for my own accounts) but if you encourage people to use IMAP and make sure they subscribe to all remote folders then webmail users should be able to see sent and deleted mail in Outook (just make sure "save copy to sent" is configured in webmail!). But I do know that some older versions of Outlook are troublesome when it comes to IMAP and you have to jump through all sorts of unnecessary hoops to make it sync.

Oddly enough I never have any problems with either Outlook Express or Windows Mail when configured for either pop or imap, the key to their success is, I think, their simplicity. I'm trying to encourage Outlook users to migrate to Thunderbird/Lightning

[David O'Neil]

...I'm trying to encourage Outlook users to migrate to Thunderbird/Lightning

Even though I like the basic functionality of Thunderbird better than Outlook, the fact that form letters can be sent through Outlook from Word, emails can be flagged for follow-up, it is integrated so tightly with the contact manager (and you can even flag individual contacts if you want), separate contact lists can be kept in Outlook, and some of Outlook's other goodies make the Thunderbird/Lightning route seem primitive. Perhaps you know some tricks I'm unaware of? The Lightning pages don't indicate it can do these things. On the other hand, I liked the way Thunderbird formatted email messages, and its search feature in 3.0 was so much better than Outlooks, at least the 2003 version I have.

[ckh]

I use Outlook as a secondary email client only because my wife uses it exclusively. Otherwise, I wouldn't use it at all. This is a personal preference. Thunderbird works better for my needs. I mainly use text email, need to view the source of the emails often to view the headers, write/reply to mainly one person at a time but sometimes cc a few others. I often need to go back and search for previous emails going back a couple years. I'm not a fan of html email at all.

I don't need the bulk or extras that are included in Outlook, just something simpler.

My wife, however, uses the contact manager, notes, calendar, etc quite extensively so Outlook is the best fit for her. I mainly use Outlook so I can sync her calendar so I know what her schedule is and use it only for sending/receiving emails/appointments/etc from her that Outlook provides.

[gracehjs]

Tell them to use mail2web.com to look at their email on the web. That is what I use when I am away from home. I works great and does not interfere with your mail.

[QUOTE=stlewis;396203]The plea I get is: "I want to get my emails via Gmail for when I am out of the office, but then have them in Outlook when I get back". The server I look after (Linux, postfix) does not allow collection and relaying/forwarding; I don't know if this a generic rule or whether some servers allow it. And most ISPs now seem to QUOTE]

[Big Frank]

Tell them to use mail2web.com to look at their email on the web. That is what I use when I am away from home. I works great and does not interfere with your mail.

That's fine and dandy if you want to put your personal email address and password details into a site that you actually know nothing about.

What about a site called "bank2web" that allowed you to check any of your bank accounts online if you just type in your account number and PIN.

Would you worry about how safe that is?

mail2web.com is an e-mail retrieval service started in 1997 by SoftCom Technology Consulting Inc., a private company based in Toronto, Ontario, Canada. The service functions as an email application, such as Mozilla Thunderbird or Microsoft Outlook, but from a web interface. The service is used by over sixteen million users monthly in over 200 countries (according to them and I have no reason to disbelieve those figures).

A private company.

Call me paranoid android if you like, but there's no way you'll get me to tap in the username and password of any of my main email accounts into a non-SSL secured open web interface.