Wire Mesh

[David O'Neil]

...you would think the basic technology is already there.

It doesn't appear to be. The following is just one example that shows the lack of transform capabilities of the mould tool. The concept I've illustrated shows just one of the limitations that is probably hindering the addition of a mesh tool. It may take a core rewrite to get this to work as it should, and that probably explains why HTML and other items get done first, and this sits on the back burner.

[inabottle]

I use xara as a vector program, no an imaging or raster editor, I have photoshop for that, which Im perfectly content with. I have illustrator for that matter but cant deal with the ergonomics of it. But I also refuse to update xara until, I see progress in what the core of xara is, which is a vector application. I dont mind using feathered eliptical transparent shapes and plasma and cloud transparencies. But I feel I can better do what I want done with more tools from the more professional applications. Xara has an easy logical interface that Illustrator doesnt have. But the feature set is becoming old, and needs to be revamped. I would have waited 3 years for a good update of xara instead of getting an update every year, with minor feature upgrades that I dont use or doesnt help me much artistically. Why bother with photo editing if you are expanding the PSD export abilities. But I continue to use xara the way Ive always used it and will continue to do so. But I am waiting for something big, because they can blow the vector world out of the water. One day and when that happens Ill be on the band wagon tell you what!

[amoore]

But I also refuse to update xara until, I see progress in what the core of xara is, which is a vector application.

The best way to encourage that to happen is to continue to upgrade so Xara & Co have the resources to do the sort of development you want to see. Development takes money — a lot of money. And the cost of upgrading is minimal compared to the outlay for the apps you refer to as "more professional".

[JokeArtist]

The best way to encourage that to happen is to continue to upgrade so Xara & Co have the resources to do the sort of development you want to see.

Haahahhahah! This is the most crazy thing that I've ever heard. I'm in the same position. I've refused point-blank to upgrade past x2 until I see more vector tools also. Why pay your hard earned cash for something you don't want? Surely it works the other way round - Xara spend money developing the vector side and all the people will upgrade in droves. And you might even get some Corel Draw and Illustrator people willing to pay-to-play.

[handrawn]

you cannot have it both ways

[MarkMyWords]

I agree, it is not for the customer to keep paying for something they don't want in the hope that Xara will deliver what they do want "sometime in the future". It is for Xara and other software makers to make their product and sell it.

Presumably Xara know their market and, within the confines of their finances, are playing to that as best they can. Looking at recent updates, that does not point toward them getting back to making more ground-breaking vector tools in the near future, unfortunately.

Maybe if Google or some other sizeable company got interested in owning a vector graphics program, much needed finance would come in and quicker progress could be made in that direction. How likely is that though?

I think we can pretty much see the writing on the wall, without significant investment, Xtreme is likely to slowly fade away. In my opinion that process has already started.

[ss-kalm]

........... without significant investment, Xtreme is likely to slowly fade away. In my opinion that process has already started.

Obviously only personal opinion, but in my opinion it's now a better programme than ever. It all depends what you need it for.

However, I find it hard to believe that Xara don't know what their target market is. Perhaps the people who only want vector tools and aren't bothering to upgrade anyway aren't actually the target market ...........

Although I do agree with Joke Artist. You have to speculate to accumulate. It's up to Xara (Magix) to fund development to hopefully recoup manyfold their investment. Not hope that people upgrade to fund development.

[inabottle]

The best way to encourage that to happen is to continue to upgrade so Xara & Co have the resources to do the sort of development you want to see. Development takes money — a lot of money. And the cost of upgrading is minimal compared to the outlay for the apps you refer to as "more professional".

I would upgrade the product if they offered me a reason to upgrade it. I use Xara as a Vector Application. So why ugrade when the only thing that is getting developed is the photo aspect, which it does mediocre and there are free applications out there that does it just as good or better.

So due to the trends over the past few versions, I can see they are moving away from the vector aspect of there program and concetrating on the photography side of it. By buying the product Im encourage further developement in that aspect of the application.

[RTK]

Have a look at the other thread here: http://www.talkgraphics.com/showthre...t=15540&page=5
I don't know why I picked the older thread to give my reply but if you think the mesh tool is easy to use, thing again. To do any drawing using the mesh tool especially the face you need to have an understanding of the bone structure and to do that type of drawing takes planning.

Having said how hard it is to use I definitely think that Xara needs to improve it vector tools and the Mesh Tool should be one but I still think that vector brushes should be number one. Sorry that is just from my point of view.

Albacore, I agree with everything you said here. 100%.

Blabbering on, the mesh tool is quite a simple way to add subtle nuances of colour to any vector shape. It's a "4-point-plus-whatever you need it to be-fill" to anything, you want to make happen. "Bone structure" never even entered my thoughts... Being able to easily add colour to any shape did.

I don't think everyone wants (or needs) to realistically copy photographs of faces, fruit and musical instruments -- some would just like to have the ability/option to "float/add" colour.

I saw an amazing "Bob-Hahn-Like" illustration in one of my wife's magazine (probably Entertainment Weekly) a while ago (I will try to find it) in the bathroom (where the normally end up... ). Even if I can't find it -- the artist turned all (I would assume) cartoon-like lines in to ONE shape, and "meshed it" with colour to make the cells (fill colours) of clothing and other things to really pop using complementary colours on the lines adjacent to the filled shapes. It was brilliant and beautiful (and really simple). Probably a useless option to many -- but it could be really sweet to many more.

Just being able to easily add "flavour/interest" to simple shapes would be great for anyone, no? Yes, there will always be people that want to "suffer... " to create amazing photo-realistic things that we all marvel at -- if they wish to be "crazy" and a mesh tool helps -- why not let them have that option to "suffer" in Xara also? It's about options and the mesh tool, should by now be a basic one.

Risto

[sgiff]

I also would like to chime in for a mesh tool. It is true that Xara has really left out any new and innovative development from their vector tools for far to long. There is some really cool stuff happening out there and it should be happening inside XARA. The only way that XARA will stay viable as an app is if it continues to be innovative like it was in the beginning. I know for a fact that the XARA team could make a much more innovative and easier to use mesh tool than what Illustrator has. It seems that XARA has added more and more tools or effects that actually use pixel based data like most of the non-destructive filters that were recently added. A while back I proposed another innovative way that would in my opinion really eliminate the mesh tool if done properly. What if there were a tool in the tool pallete that actually was a smooth pixel based airbrush and if you had a shape selected you could select the airbrush tool and paint smooth gradients or shading right inside the shape. The shape would act as a mask automatically and clip the painted area. This way you could control exactly your blends and shading and do it very quickly.

Also one other thing I have seen very cool recently in a tool called Paint SAI that I mentioned here is that when editing vectors outlines, you can select a tool which allows you to drag on a node and it thins or thickens the line at that point. Very cool idea!!