"Drawing" with Xara

[tomos]

I have a copy Xara (X1) but dont have installed.

was trying to find out some info about it first

I own and use Freehand 9 which is a great programme but apparently theres problems with exporting to PDF (with fonts and colour of bitmap images) and also problems with open type fonts.
(Also problems with insecure future )

So, I'm looking at Xara.
I would be looking at upgrading to Pro but I presume the basic tools are the same across the range.

In the Freehand forum at Adobe I came across a thread http://www.adobe.com/cfusion/webforu...&keyword1=xara about Xara where someone name JETLT made the following post (it's about halfway down the page)

Xara wants its Shape Editor Tool to be the primary drawing tool. It works much like the historic "bendomatic" technique in FH (something I highly favor). But that method is just that--a wonderful method to have available. It is not the most expedient way to draw all of the time. Experienced users of Bezier-based drawing programs want to be able to fluidly place corner/curve points--with predictable results--as they draw. Xara's Shape Editor Tool lets you use keyboard shortcuts to specify whether the next segment you place will be straight or curved; but whatever criteria it uses to position the extended curve handles seems unsophisticated and utterly arbitrary relative to the path being drawn. So essentially, yes, you can cause the handles to be extended when you place the point, but you still have to go back and then edit them before proceeding on to the next segment. This is not efficient to any proficient user of AI or FH.

A Pen Tool is provided. But the program's own documentation all but denegrates this tool, saying somthing akin to "for users who want to torture themselves." The Pen works by conventional click and clickDrag as one would expect. But by all appearances, this tool is considered a mere "me, too" afterthought. Using Xara's preferred Shape Editor Tool, you can do all the momentary overrides to edit the pre-existng segments of the current path and then resume drawing the path from where you leave off. But not so with the Pen.

"The Pen works by conventional click and clickDrag as one would expect. But by all appearances, this tool is considered a mere "me, too" afterthought."
He's not very clear why just an afterthought & why it's not so good ..

unfortunately in spite of loads of "demos" at the xara website I couldnt find any showing the pen tool in sight (they may be there but aren't adverstised!)

I did see an unnamed tool - looked like a pencil to me - after drawing a freehand line it turns into a vector line with points.

I guess I'm looking for some feedback from Xara users, maybe especially people who could further compare its drawing/pen functionality with the bezier pen in FreeHand or Illustrator.

thanks in advance,
tom

.. maybe I should see can I download a manual from Xara ..
EDIT: couldnt find any manual.

[haakoo]

Hi there,

take a look at this placehttp://www.xaraxone.com/
extensive workouts on all features of XaraXtreme(pro)

Gr,Hans

[tomos]

hmm
I did find this thread:
http://www.talkgraphics.com/showthre...light=Freehand
and this about drawing tools
http://www.xaraxone.com/webxealot/workbook34/page_3.htm


it does seem fairly inefficient way of working if you're used to bezier curves ...

funny they say about the pen tool -

Here's how it works. The example above starts on the far left with a single click. The second point is clicked down on the page and then you drag in the opposite direction in which you want the curve to be drawn. (This is what I mean about non-intuitive). To add a straight line segment, just click the next control point, but do not drag.

The example above shows the path around the shape with the clicks and click and drags noted as well as the direction of the drag indicated with the red arrows. This is a drawing technique only a glutton for punishment could love!

very obvious bias against there, as I say I find it funny because it sounds like they have implemented a basic version of pen, then say its rubbish, then offer a, to my mind, much more convoluted way of doing things ..

Re the Shape Editor Tool -

In the example above the line segments are automatically converted to curves as they are dragged with the Shape Editor Tool. No fuss ! No muss! as you find with other drawing applications.

TIP: You can edit the line segments while you are drawing. This is the beauty of the Shape Editor Tool. No need to switch to another drawing tool, or convert the line to curve before you edit. Just click and drag. Simple.

no fuss! no muss
with "other" drawing applications I don't have to go back to edit in the first place ... because I have total control over the line as I draw

as for non intuitive I think it took me all of 15 minutes to learn the basics of pen tool.
Apologies, I getting a bit upset here I'll go have a cup of tea

[tomos]

Hi there,

take a look at this placehttp://www.xaraxone.com/
extensive workouts on all features of XaraXtreme(pro)

Gr,Hans

thanks Hans
I posted the last post before seeing yours;
Grüße, Tom

[Telovne]

I can't remember if this applies to Xara X1, as I now only use Xara Xtreme.
Use the freehand/brush tool (the one you said looks like a pencil) for freehand drawing, you can turn down the 'Freehand Smoothing' slider to prevent Xara from smoothing out your lines. In fact you can set any amount of smoothing 0-100%. Also, any time after drawing the line you can use the 'Shape Editor Tool' to highlight (drag select), all or any part of the line to edit the smoothing should you need to smooth it out a little. (This is used with the smaller 'Smoothing' Slider (as opposed to the 'Freehand Smoothing' Slider). The one thing that does irritate me and I haven't found how to stop this, is after drawing a freehand line, Xara always displays the selection points handles on the last drawn line. Which is distracting if drawing freehand.

[Soquili]

Hello Tomos,

Welcome to Talkgraphics.

As Hans mentioned, the http://www.xaraxone.com is a wonderful resource for users of Xara's programs.

In particular workbooks 30 and 31 http://www.xaraxone.com/html/workbook.html show how the tools can be used.

I have used Illustrator and Freehand, but find that Xara X, X¹, Xtreme and Xtreme Pro are more intuitive and easier to learn.

If you are a long time Freehand or Illustrator user, it will be more difficult to unlearn their ways and learn the easier ways of Xara's applications.

After learning to create images with Xara's applications I cannot bring myself to use other vector programs. Fortunately I have the freedom to do so, which other's may not have.

[tomos]

thanks for the replies people

okay, that sounds more positive!

would you be able to tell me Soquili (or anyone else!)
is there a difference between X1 and the latest Xtreme pro in terms of basic functionality of drawing tools ?

(I ask only cause I got a liscence for X1 on offer a while ago, but if there's been an improvement in basic functionality since I may as well testrun the more recent version.)


PS in case any Xara people are reading:
those derogotary remarks in the workbook about pen tool/indirectly about other programmes got my back up earlier.
Xara won't win any Freehand users looking for a new home like that ...

[remi]

those derogotary remarks in the workbook about pen tool/indirectly about other programmes got my back up earlier.
Xara won't win any Freehand users looking for a new home like that ...

About what comments are you talking in detail?

[Soquili]

Tomos, Xara X¹ and Xtreme Pro have the same basic tools. Xtreme Pro is the newer version and has some additional features, like ability to export to .swf animation and export to PDF. Xtreme Pro also supports multiple pages. A comparison of Xara Xtreme to Xtreme Pro can be seen at http://www.xara.com/products/xtreme/?v=&?t=

[tomos]

thanks a lot, Soquili -
I'll go ahead try out the version I have then


remi -
I don't mean to offend anyone and
maybe I was over-reacting, even reading in things that weren't there?
if so I apologise in advance!

but,
the tone certainly is a bit patronising in it's attitude towards other methods ...
as quoted above re pen tool:

The example above shows the path around the shape with the clicks and click and drags noted as well as the direction of the drag indicated with the red arrows. This is a drawing technique only a glutton for punishment could love!

if implemented correctly (as in FH & ai) I cant imagine a more efficient and accurate method. Once you get the hang of it (as i say above it took me 15 mins to understand & use the pen tool reasonably, but then someone did show it to me)

and re Shape Tool

In the example above the line segments are automatically converted to curves as they are dragged with the Shape Editor Tool. No fuss ! No muss! as you find with other drawing applications.

but then in fairness, again re Shape tool (from page quoted above)

TIP: You can edit the line segments while you are drawing. This is the beauty of the Shape Editor Tool. No need to switch to another drawing tool, or convert the line to curve before you edit. Just click and drag. Simple.

which sounds just like I would describe the Pen tool in FH
But I guess it was being called a glutton for punishment that set me off

so I'm going around in circles -
I'll go try it out instead and stop pestering ye all.
tom