How do I hold the integrity of CMYK colors in and out of XXP?

[Tao jones]

the problem I have is the colour shift from XARA cmyk to PS CMYK. How can you keep the same colour in both programs. The colours change in CS2 when exported from XARA. Is it something to do with the black point setting in PS or the CMYK profile not the same as XARA pro. Or is it maybe my monitor. Here is a sample. All have the same colour percentages..thanks taojones

[minimiro]

I work on hardware calibrated monitor iiyama MM904UT Vision master PRO - calibrated with gretac macbeth eye one pro device.

This difference that you see come from difference from Xara print preview and icc monitor calibration in photoshop. Xara's preview is based on some generic monitor profile I think, photoshop used concrete icc for concrete monitor, concrete type RGB and some custom CMYK icc....
Here on my monitor, photoshop colors are one idea cold and darker than xara

Till Xara lead in icc suport and monitor calibration I dont think that you can see same color here and there
By me, photoshop CMYK preview is much more accurate
For this reason, after export from xara I always preffer to make a litlle tune-ups in colors in Photoshop

[davelash]

Survival Tips for Xara CMYK:
1. Enter all CMYK colors into Xara by formula only; never use the the Xara Color Picker or eyeball a color match as both methods rely on RGB and not CMYK.

2. If you need to match bitmap colors, do so in Photoshop or other program first, then bring the formulas into Xara via the Color Gallery.

3. Be careful with shadows, gradients, and transparency: Xara will convert your CMYK color back to RGB (see Xara Help under CMYK).

4. Set your monitor to Simulate Print Colors via Windows > Show Printer Colors

Discussion
This thread has been tremendously helpful. Minimiro is obviously a high priest of XaraCMYK; may he profit accordingly! Thank you for your help.

My original error was twofold: 1) trusting that the Xara Color Picker was working in CMYK space, and 2) importing bitmaps into XXP and using the CMYK sliders to "match" the colors. As replies in this thread seem to make clear, in both cases I was unknowingly working in RGB and not CMYK despite the Color Editor giving me that impression. The compounding color errors I was experiencing were primarily RGB/CMYK translation problems.

As a test of the survival tips above, I exported 5 test colors from Xara via pdf and eps. I opened each in Photoshop and used the PS color picker to check the CMYK colors: all 5 colors transported perfectly via pdf; one of the eps colors was perfect, the other 4 were 1 or 2 digits off, i.e. a '24' might be a '23': still very acceptable.

Obviously, there's still much more to learn, but I feel much more confident now that I can 1) create a CMYK palette (outside of Xara), 2) duplicate that palette into Xara Color Gallery via formulas, 3) work in Xara CYMK space as long as I don't rely on the Color Picker or visual color matching, and 4) export CMYK art reliably from Xara via pdf or eps.

I am not sure how much mischief shadows, gradients, and transparency will do in the process...To Be Continued

[Tao jones]

thanks Minimiro your input helps heaps..tj

[Squeaky]

I seem to spent too much of my life tweaking Xara Xported CMYK colours in Photoshop. I hoped to do less of this in Pro but alas......

I can't emphasise how important it is for an illustrator be able to see the colours he is going to export!

[Tao jones]

it seems Squeaky from the tests I have done that PDF is the best way to export CMYK I get the same colours in Xara and PS this way..tao

[minimiro]

yes CMYK tweak used some time, but what you say about CMYK + 1-2Pantones
Like todays work.. CMYK + one pantone metalik with light effects used
or like yesterday's work - CMYK+3 pantones
The true is to downsample your designs. Some of prepress things in Xara must be created by hand.

Exampe from today:
some simple design for work-calendar, there was no problems untill client say I want this, this and this element to be printed in gold.... ok for pure vector elements there was no problems, but in one element (where I simulate gold 2007 with bleaches, dark shadows, blurred elements etc etc) I will have big problems, much bigger problem come from one line let say, which was under this 2007 and its shadow and which line client obligatory want to be in gold....
Houston we have a problem...
Here help come from PSD export (but PSD still can t export in CMYK )
I divide design on layers, one for background - also exported and like CMYK EPS to photoshop, one for Pantone elements including white bleaches from 2007, one for vector elements which was exported like CMX for future use in final work in CDR, one for image of hotel, and over all this one layer for 2007 lighting elements - shadows, bleaches etc.
PSD is opened in photoshop and converted to CMYK
new background with absolutly exact values for CMYK was placed from previous exported like CMYK EPS background, maked some tweaks in layer with hotel photo, after that I select layer with elements that must be in gold, then created new spot channel and placed it, with the same sellection I make breaks in all other CMYK layers and elements, 'cose by deffault pantone channel is overprinted. after that layer with 2007 lighting effects come to its right place over gold and voila left only to apply shadow to layer (which shadow looks like shadow and for pantone also) and delicate part of this prepress was finished
after all this, PSD was flaten, and saved with SPOT channel data
After that imported in Corel X3, combined with ther vector ellements previously exported like CMX and WTF... we are ready
I think that many people will find much more intricate way to decide problems like this, instead of to think a litlle, and with few actions to finish work

I hope you understand me with my bad english

Best regards
minimiro

[Tao jones]

I sort of get what you are saying..there is always a work around. Looks like a good calendar.
Minimiro how do you save PDFs from Xara to open in coreldraw x3. I always get this file is corrupted. They open in CS2..thanks tao

[minimiro]

using old good way

PDF 1.3
color model - CMYK
view PDF when finished

bitmap compresion - none
convert text to shapes
exclude invisble layers
do not generate reader layers
custom icc profile - photoshop 5 def

this work fine

if you use transp, shadows, bevels etc - my suggestion is first to convert them to bitmap (without print preview turned on when converting)
and then export to PDF

[Tao jones]

You Are A Master!..ta