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  1. #11
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    Aug 2000
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    Risto

    Please wait a week and then e-mail me and let me know if you really want me to remove your excellent contributions from the Xara Xone.

    If this is what you really want, I will reluctantly do it.

    Gary

    Gary Priester

    Moderator Person


    Click to make The Xara Xone #1

    <a href="http://www.gwpriester.com">
    www.gwpriester.com </a>




  2. #12
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    Aug 2000
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    Prince Edward Island, Canada --- The land of lawn tractors
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    Gary - another option is for you to take the time to really think about the ethics of the "click here" promotion strategy. Of course you are right about the nice referal benefits of the XaraXone ranking highly at graphics.com - that's not the part to think about. Rather think about the somewhat artificial means being used to boost the ranking and what do you think was the original intention behind Chris' including the rankings on his site. Others have repeatedly told you they believe the "click here" promotion strategy is unethical. Why do you think that is?

    I personally side with those uncomfortable with the strategy. I certainly don't see the benefits as a justification. Either it is ethical or it isn't.

    I wish Chris would just can the whole rankings feature. I realize he probably has a benefit in even hollow hits in that he can tell his advertisers his site is getting so many hits. Likewise, I understand that the XaraXone's sponsors probably like to hear that the site is getting lots of hits. Those aspects should not override the underlying ethical question.

    Regards, Ross

    <a href=http://www.designstop.com/>DesignStop.Com</a>

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    British Columbia, Canada
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    326

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>By Risto Klint:
    GroWeb - I appreciate your concern for me! http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/smile.gif Perhaps, you just missed the self-censored (Like the last one...) and deleted threads?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
    It really is concern, and I am taking your smiley as an indication that you realize that. And no, I don't think I missed any of the threads that have come up here, though I may have missed the censored part of a self-censored post. However, I think the self-censoring was an well-intentioned attempt at damage control. If Gary were adamant about ideas he had expressed, he would not have censored them. Try to see positive motives in his actions rather than assuming ill intent. (This is what I meant by being positive rather than negative.) And even where the intent may be wrong, rise above it; why get your nose out of joint? You know that Gary's general pattern around here is very positive and helpful. Allow him to be wrong once in a while. Agree to disagree, and move on.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>By Risto Klint:
    Your quote: "You seem to have gone from being... etc..." I guess you missed the other posts around here... TG and PP are not the only forums on the web. It might come as a shock to you but there is also something called: "helping out in your community..."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I know that TG and PP are not the only forums on the web; but what has that to do with what we are discussing? And, as I mentioned above, I think I have caught the other posts around here.

    Correct me if I'm wrong here, but your comment about the "something called: 'helping out in your community'" seems like an angry attempt to make me feel bad about myself. Speaking as a person who does a great deal of volunteer work, and whose profession is a not-very-well-paid social service, I can assure you that you are wrong about this. Web forums are not the only form of community to which one can contribute. And you will perhaps notice that my posts in these forums -- including the two in this thread -- have invariably been efforts to contribute constructively to this community.

    Getting back to the point: how come you're taking such umbrage in response to Gary's actions? There are bigger fish to fry. And besides, it looks from here as though he has recognized his mistakes and is trying to build bridges (though there is probably more he could do in this direction). The actions on your part that have concerned me include a decision in the recent past to pack up and boycott this forum (a decision you reversed in response to others' expressions of concern), and the decision to have all reference to you removed from the XaraXone. These actions stem from emotions that seem rather out of proportion to the events that have apparently set them off. What's up?

    Glen
    There are two kinds of people in the world: those who think there are two kinds of people in the world, and those who don’t.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
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    Placitas, New Mexico, USA
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    I respect your opinion.

    I have removed the New Week thread and the Click Here on my signature.

    Gary

    Gary Priester

    Moderator Person


    <a href="http://www.gwpriester.com">
    www.gwpriester.com </a>




  5. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
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    4,894

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    I do appreciate your concern.

    More than enough have already been said on this issue, don't you think?

    Risto

    risto@ristoklint.com

    Visit my web site!

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    British Columbia, Canada
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>by Risto Klint:
    More than enough have already been said on this issue, don't you think?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Absolutely!

    Glen
    There are two kinds of people in the world: those who think there are two kinds of people in the world, and those who don’t.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Posts
    3,220

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    Oh for heaven's sake... must have been a full moon recently eh?

    Well, laundry duty calls and I can't do it here so...

    Happy Creat'n all

  8. #18
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    Aug 2000
    Location
    Prince Edward Island, Canada --- The land of lawn tractors
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    Ya, let's move forward. Gary's "frame challenge" thread still has lots of room in it for more postings!

    Regards to all,
    Ross

    <a href=http://www.designstop.com/>DesignStop.Com</a>

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Location
    RWC, CA, USA
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    by Ross Macintosh
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>I wish Chris would just can the whole rankings feature.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
    What were we doing before all this started up, huh? Being a happy little (large, lurkers included http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif ) group of folks sharing, laughing and learning and discussing. Now it's a little war of words, hurt feelings, mis communication and so forth and so on.

    I for one would love for all this to just go away and for there to be a new way to support the Xone that all can agree upon.

    Pixelparity is a fine forum and I have seen some new works and old (Derek you know who you are! http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/biggrin.gif ) and all it does is inspire me. I think that it is another fine way to support and get the word out about XaraX.

    Of course the real way for this to happen is for Xara Ltd. to get off of their proverbial @sses and do the work themselves and leave the communities to do what they do best (mentioned above) and as a result of the communities existence promote and build a stonger user base by just being there to help out the newbies and have galleries and all that good stuff.

    In what I am getting from all of this mess is that it seems that Gary has taken this upon himself to promote this software anyway he can and I don't blame him, no one wants to see XaraX fade away but if this promoting is causing rifts in the community and the community is split what good are we doing for each other?? Xara Ltd. should see what is happening here and help get the word out by creating flyers and promotions that are not just on the web. Get the software out into the stores and so forth and so on. This lack of support for it's own flag ship product and their lack in good common business practices in promoting and distributing their own fricken product disgusts me to no end. It's not your job Gary or any one here in the forums, it's Xara Ltd responsibility. It's neither your fault or Risto's, it's Xara Ltd's for their lack of promotion and distribution and making excuses for them that "they've always done business like this" well then it's time for a change or go away!!

    This sort of stuff turns me off completely. I admire both of you so much. And it's just a shame that this goes on but the simplest solution would be for Chris to put the Kibosh on the whole rankings feature seeing as Xara Ltd. isn't about to make things right in their own way by doing what they should be doing.

    If Gary really wants to promote the XaraXone then perhaps he and Thomas needs to sit down and find a way to include a little button at the top of the page so that it's non intrusive to the rest of the forum that would take the person to the Xone where a button resides there to then take the user to Graphics.com to click away.

    I'm not sure I even like that but it's something.

    Just my humble .02¢

    Richard http://www.talkgraphics.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

    ---Wolff On The Prowl---

    [This message was edited by RAMWolff on March 20, 2003 at 10:46.]
    Richard

    ---Wolff On The Prowl---

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Posts
    18

    Default

    You know, if Xara placed that link to Graphics.com on their main site, they'd generate far more traffic than anything TalkGraphics itself could ever generate. Seems like a win-win situation to me. Why not encourage them to give it a try? Failing that, they could run a banner on the top of this page -- either way, then Gary wouldn't have to constantly "rally the troops".

    Best wishes to all!

    Chris Dickman

 

 

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